Answered5 years ago
What are the key costs and considerations when comparing Thai Retirement, Marriage, and Elite Visas for expats?
I am attempting to make a graph comparing the costs of retirement and marriage visas to Elite Visas. Am I forgetting anything?
Retirement Visa
Escrow Account (refundable) 800,000 THB
Lost Investment Income @~4.5%
Bank Interest (.05%) (4,000)
Bank Letter Annual 300
Visa Fee Annual 1900
Photographs/Copies Annual 100
Agent Renewal Fee Annual 6000
Agent 90 Day Reporting Annual 1800
Multiple Re-entry Permit Annual 3800
Elite Easy Access
5 Year Membership 600,000 THB
Lost Investment Income @~5%
Elite Superiority Extension
20 Year Membership 1,000,000 THB
Lost Investment Income @~5%
Retirement Visa
Escrow Account (refundable) 800,000 THB
Lost Investment Income @~4.5%
Bank Interest (.05%) (4,000)
Bank Letter Annual 300
Visa Fee Annual 1900
Photographs/Copies Annual 100
Agent Renewal Fee Annual 6000
Agent 90 Day Reporting Annual 1800
Multiple Re-entry Permit Annual 3800
Elite Easy Access
5 Year Membership 600,000 THB
Lost Investment Income @~5%
Elite Superiority Extension
20 Year Membership 1,000,000 THB
Lost Investment Income @~5%
Answer summary
The post discusses the various costs associated with Retirement, Marriage, and Elite Visas in Thailand, focusing on initial and annual financial commitments. It compares costs such as escrow account requirements, lost investment income, agent fees, and bank letter costs. The conversation emphasizes the importance of factoring in convenience versus costs, highlighting alternatives like using agents for hassle-free processing, and considerations like inflation and the ability to work under a marriage visa. The discussion also notes the potential for financial loss from tied-up funds and the comparative lifetime of each visa type.
101 repliesnewest first
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Peter *********
UOB no charge for letter and no charge for yearly statement
Jonas *************
Please calculate the costs.
Colin *********
You could double your bank letter to 600 baht/year as they always seem to feck up the first attempt/copy and you have to go back, wait and queue again for a second attempt (Personal experience every time with Kasikorn Bank!)
Bobby ********
Colin Shearer. Change banks! I get brilliant service from Bangkok Bank. No queues. Immediate service, they get it right every time. 100 baht for letter. 200 baht for last twelve month's statements!
Aaron *******
With the Elite, do you pay the 600,000 every 5 years, or just once?
Ivan ************
If you buy the 5 year for 600k and decide at the end of it you want to renew, you can get a further 15 years for 400k (i.e. "upgrade" to the 20 year at the end of your 5 years). This actually makes more sense than paying 1m up front for the 20 year, if you are considering it- besides hanging on to 400k for an extra 5 years, you have a minor perk for the first 5 years that you get free airport transfers, you don't get those on the 1m 20y and lose them when you upgrade to it.
Rob **********
@Aaron ******
yes you do
Brook ********
OP@Aaron ******
it depends on which plan you choose. The ฿600,000 tier is every 5 years.Nick **********
Doesn't make much sense.
You throw money away to agents for something you can do yourself for free, but at the same time you're worried about the cost of bank letters and copies ? It takes more time to even only contact an agent than to do the 90 day reporting itself (when the online reporting is working)
Maybe then you also have to take into account your bus fare or taxi cost ?
And Elite Visa holders also have to do 90 day reporting. And if you stay longer than 12 months on Thailand, then Elite Visa holders also have to do an extension of stay.
You throw money away to agents for something you can do yourself for free, but at the same time you're worried about the cost of bank letters and copies ? It takes more time to even only contact an agent than to do the 90 day reporting itself (when the online reporting is working)
Maybe then you also have to take into account your bus fare or taxi cost ?
And Elite Visa holders also have to do 90 day reporting. And if you stay longer than 12 months on Thailand, then Elite Visa holders also have to do an extension of stay.
Nick **********
@Todd ********
now you've completely lost me... must be some serious misunderstanding between us.. :What does this mean : "diff between using agent (cheaper) and the 800k method" ?
There is no cheap agent method to get the retirement visa. Unless maybe some illegal under the table method you are referring to ?
OP wasn't talking about diff between 800k and agent. OP was talking about the cost of the 800K method, in which he thinks you have to pay an agent for something which most of the times is quicker to do yourself than to contact an agent. Why would you even pay for that ? Doesn't make any sense.
You'd pay for something when your time is too valuable, which in case of 90 days reporting in most cases isn't. But OP taking into consideration some ridiculous loose change costs, suggests tho me it could make a difference.
If OP makes so much money that paying an agent is worth it instead of reporting himself, then why even mention the cost of photocopies (2 baht per page ?) or bank letter (100 baht).
Todd *********
@Nick *********
we would be a bit of a fool to lock up 800k at 0-1%. Can you understand that from a math perspective? This is dead money. Money never sleeps. Unless you let it.This is a critical point also - there is not ‘a link’ to everything in the world. An agent will charge you 15,000 baht for a retirement visa.
Understanding money has EVERYTHING to do with it. If you don’t understand It’s like being handicapped, it makes life difficult. I have many friends and family whom understand well. But it makes this conversation unnecessary
Ivan ************
@Ni**
I don't judge people who do it but he should at least be clear about what it is he's suggesting.Nick **********
@Ivan ***********
which means it's not something he should recommend. Like running a red light and claiming it gets you home faster. Only works until it doesn't.
There are posts of people who have run into serious problems by using this "option", where the agent didn't return their passport and they went into overstay for several months.
Ridiculous to suggest illegal methods to try to save some money to be locked into an account.
Ivan ************
@Ni**
he's talking about using a dodgy agent that gets you an extension under the counter without meeting the requirements. Some people are OK with that, some are not, it's the sort of thing that works fine... until it doesn't, and then maybe you have big problems. Or maybe not, I know people have been doing this for decades. I don't think I'd take this avenue personally though.Nick **********
@Todd ********
Mr. Money Expert still not capable of answering a simple question ?? 🤣🤣🤣🤣Nick **********
@Todd ********
After stripping out all the useless wordsalad, the only thing you said is - again- that there is no requirement to lock up 800k baht if you use an agent. All the rest you typed is a complete waste at trying to insult, but adds nothing to the discussion. Probably just a smokescreen to hide your mistake.
Your claim is wrong. It is fake.
Keep it simple : enlighten us. Show us the info. Show us the links.
You typing words doesn't prove anything.
Show us the link that immigration allows you to drop the 800k requirement if you use an agent.
Back up your claims with proof.
Maybe I could be wrong.
But why are you spewing all these big words without providing any proof ?
If you know so much, should be easy to give a few links to back up your claims, unless it's all fake.
You made a claim.
I am not convinced of your claim, so I ask you to prove it.
That's how it works. Very simple. Should be easy for you to point us to the proof.
If you can't do that, then your words aren't worth anything.
Todd *********
@Nick *********
lol. Why do you talk like this when you know nothing? Why? Stop. Learn. Shut up. The old saying is that ‘you can’t fix stupid’. Of course there is NO requirement to lock up 800k with an agent visa. Stop 🛑. Learn. Ignorance is not virtuous.
Shake your head. Stop running your mouth and activate your brain.
Clearly you don’t understand how the agencies work in most nations. I’m done ✅ You cannot help fools and their money.
Nick **********
@Todd ********
Really ? are we being patronizing now ? Has nothing to do with understanding money, there is hardly anything to understand. You're strawmanning.When you pay an agent
*****
to do some running for you, it doesn't change the requirement to have 800k locked up.So you'll still end up with 800k dead money.
What it seems to me, is that you advise to follow an illegal under the table way to get a retirement visa... just to save a measly percentage on the 800k.
Is that your advice ? If so, then it is clearly YOU who doesn't understand money.
If you have to resort to illegal practices to save such a ridiculously small amount of pocket money, then you're making very bad investments.
Please show me the link to that retirement visa which doesn't require the 800k or 65k per month...
Todd *********
@Nick *********
of course it makes sense.But you have to know how to do math. For sure there is cheap agent. But as I said, you have to understand money. If you don’t, we’ll, you are stuck. The agent cost is 15k per year or so.
If you put 800k baht in the bank in Thailand (this is the method people with no understanding of finance use) you have 800k tied up at very low or no interest. It’s very easy to make 6% on an invested 800k. That would be 48,000 baht per year. So leave that money invested, take the 48k, pay your agent 15k… and keep 33k to yourself.
The loose change is tiny, so doesn’t really matter
Nick **********
@Todd ********
Well, explain it to me then. Explain why it is not correct.You need 800k for the retirement visa.
Paying an agent to do the running is a cost independent of the 800K locked up in the bank.
Just being pedantic by saying "you don't understand" is an easy way out.
Give me a link to the retirement visa which doesn't need 800k in the bank (or 65k monthly, or combination)
"Understanding money" has nothing to do with it. Give me the link, and explain it to me.
Todd *********
@Nick *********
not correct at all. But people that can’t understand how money works will never understand.Nick **********
@Todd ********
this how money works :Don't use agent : do it yourself = free. But lose time which could be more valuable depending on how you make money.
Use agent = lose money to agent. But could be profitable if during that same time you make more money with your business than you pay the agent.
The 800k at the bank is dead money in both cases, so why woukd you make any calculations with that 800k depending if you use agent or not ?
Nick **********
@Todd ********
your "understanding money" is not only extremely patronizing, but also nit explaining anything.Instead of talking about "understanding money" why not explain me which retirement visa doesn't require 800k but only an agent. Exactly because the way money works, I have absolutely no idea why OP would worry about loose change in his calculation.
Could you give me the name of that visa and the exact requirements of that visa you are referring to which you claim is a good choice for those who "understand money" ?
Brook ********
OP@Nick *********
Wrong. Elite Agents do the 90 day reporting for you. I added the costs and services of an agent to the retirement visa expenses in order to have a common denominator to compare it to an equivalent Elite visa for someone that wants a generally hassle free experience.
Ivan ************
I would add- that's how it works if you want actual Elite to do it, in Bangkok. In Chiang Mai it's an agent, Star Visa, that handles 90 day reports for Elite members and from everything I've heard they are a lot easier to deal with and more flexible. But it's still easier just to do it yourself.
Ivan ************
@Br***
it's easier to do 90 day yourself than have Elite do it for you. When online is working, that takes 5 minutes at home. With Elite, you have to drop your passport in to their office on one day, and then pick it up another day (two trips). They also layer their own bureaucracy and schedule on top of the existing immigration one, like they only do passport deposit on one specific day of the week, and you have to get it in to them with at least X days before the immigration deadline... it's super complicated, and basically works out that if you want them to do it you have this crazy narrow window to drop your passport in. And they are NOT flexible with anything, you have to meet their schedules EXACTLY no leeway. Easier just to do it yourself, IMO the 90 day reporting service is pointless. If you were paying an agent, they would at least be flexible about it.Nick **********
@Brook *******
Elite Agents do the 90 daybreporting for you : I didn't know that. But even so, it is not something you should take into consideration because if you do it yourself, it is quicker than using an agent. In most cases you check in online and that's it. No idea why you would pay money AND lose time using an agent to do that for you.In case you just renewed your passport or the online system is down, then of course there is more effort involved.
Todd *********
@Nick *********
that doesn’t make sense. I explained clearly the diff between using agent (cheaper) and the 800k method. If you understand how money works, it’s easy. If you don’t… well, it’s a problemNick **********
@Todd ********
still waiting for proof of this special 1 year extension of retirement visa.... Waiting..............
Ross ********
If you have the $$ in the bank WTF would you use an agent?
Jonas *************
You'r avoiding the issue of what is available to the person. If you're not 50 plus you cannot do retirement Visa. And what is the hidden cost of marriage? and the additional benefit of the elite Visa I believe is free transfers from the airport and you get whisked pass the immigration customs directly from the airplane with the private VIP car can be good benefit. The other question is if time is a cost or wasting a day going and preparing and doing immigration is fine.
Nick ************
The elite Visa is a complete RIP off.
Nick ************
@Jonas ************
you beleive but dont know?
Oliver ********
Yes. The rules, your life circumstances, and/or any of the other inputs can change over time.
William ********
Elite visa.... Don't encourage them. Poor value, marriage visa is your best value. In the end the 400 k is still yours.
David ***
@William *******
what about for married persons option ? If GF visa exists ?William ********
Nobody forces u to marry. IV 3 kids 22, 16 and 1. If u want to compare like for like try your luck with marriage outside Thailand. Doesn't seem to be a lot of success there or there wouldn't be so many of us here.
Todd *********
@William *******
marriage visa always the poor decision in the long run.Bobby ********
Todd McGowan. Nothing wrong with the "visa" component, it's the "marriage" part that has the problems 🤣🤣🤣
John *********
@Bobby *******
Are you bored Bobby?Bobby ********
Rob Hua Hin. Interesting that of all the hundreds of members in this group, you are the only one fragile enough to take offence. I do not have to clarify anything to a troll. My good mate
@Todd ********
got the message. Sleep easy!! Chortle. 🤣🤣🤣Rob **********
@Bobby *******
excellent, I will take solace in knowing you will rest peacefully tonight, just clarify your comments in future, if you are willing to impart your wisdom upon others.Bobby ********
Rob Hua Hin. Excellent! I will be able to sleep better tonight knowing that the person with the name "Hua Hin" is sleeping peacefully. Cackle. 😆😆😆
Rob **********
@Bobby *******
I don’t know if you read my comments thoroughly or not, I am never outraged, have been living here way too long for that, I just asked if you could elaborate on your comments, quite simple. I always sleep extremely well, but thanks for you concern.Bobby ********
Rob Hua Hin. The group are ok with my comments. If you are "offended" or "outraged" simply click on the "block this user" option and you will be able to sleep tonight. 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Rob **********
@Bobby *******
no meltdown here, you made a comment and I asked could you elaborate on it, quite simple. As you are giving advice to avoid a Non O visa based on marriage, you should share your infinite wisdom on the subject with the group.Bobby ********
@Rob *********
. Don't worry about it. I'd hate to be responsible for someone's total meltdown. 😆😆😆Rob **********
@Bobby *******
please explain your comment, I have been married for over 33 years, and never had a problem, so I don’t know what you are talking about, until you expand on your comment.Todd *********
@Bobby *******
it's never old til the large lady sings lolWilliam ********
@Todd ********
not for me mate.
Eliza **********
So, retirement visa you pay around 15.000 baths & you have to go many times & make fotocopies,, Elite visa, you pay 600.000 or 1 million baths not refundable, without fotocopies & visiting inmigration in 5 years. I prefer to move my ass. Second option is expensive.
Carlos *********
Bobby Howard And I think anyone who puts 800,000 bht in a third world countries bank needs their head examined.
Brook ********
OP@Carlos ********
So, paying ฿1,000,000 THB up front for 20 years is a better option in your opinion?Bobby ********
Elisa González. Retirement visa extension is 1900 baht, not
*****
! Go once only to immigration each year. Photocopying costs less than 30 baht!Eliza **********
@Bobby *******
I put allEliza **********
@Bobby *******
Retirement VisaBank Interest (.05%) (4,000)
Bank Letter Annual 300
Visa Fee Annual 1900
Photographs/Copies Annual 100
Agent Renewal Fee Annual 6000
Agent 90 Day Reporting Annual 1800
Multiple Re-entry Permit Annual 3800
Bobby ********
Brook Powers. Actually it's you who has totally missed the point! 😆
Eliza **********
@Bobby *******
GoodBrook ********
OP@Bobby *******
You miss the point.Bobby ********
Elisa González. I'd never pay an agent one baht. I can do all this myself. 😆
Ross ********
@Elisa *********
I am retired. I have plenty of time on my hands. I do not mind travelling to my immigration office and do my extention and 90 day report. They get to know me and it is so easy. I live in the north and use a small office.Todd *********
in simple terms, I invest only in equities so use 6% as the lost revenue potential. So 800k uselessly sitting in a Thai bank is missing =/- 48,000 baht annually. That covers 15k agent and 33k on your beer budget lol. Or using the 65k monthly method makes sense as long as you love queueing up at immigration annually
Dave **********
@Todd ********
you queue having 800K in the bank or the using the 65K monthly deposit!Where I'm at the annual takes 45 minutes which I can endure annually. Life does give those little problems we must overcome. .
Todd *********
@Dave *********
expensive way to do it for sure, but fair enough.Dave **********
@Todd ********
money can be any source outside of Thailand transferred in monthly and what I use is not pension money. However, agree most use retirement and or social security payments so don't think it's as niche market as you think.Todd *********
@Dave *********
I think everyone understands the ease of the 65k method. But it generally has to be pension money. And not everyone over 50 has that. It’s super easy. But it’s a niche market.Dave **********
@Todd ********
I spend/ deposit more then 65K a month and it's a Direct Deposit though the New York Branch of Bangkok Bank so not expensive at all.Dave **********
If you deposit 65K a month or more no large balance needed.
Steve *******
You need to account for inflation.
I've been here 4 years and not getting the elite visa before coming here is one of the biggest financial mistakes I've ever made.
I've been here 4 years and not getting the elite visa before coming here is one of the biggest financial mistakes I've ever made.
Garrett ***********
@Steve ******
How so?Steve *******
@Garrett **********
all of those fees added up, the baht kept getting stronger for some reason and the headache of having to renew visas and not knowing what the immigration officer would decide each time has definitely not been pleasant.David ***
Open a company get your non b Visa and WP. Try some business.
Sonny **********
@David **
be careful with that.Brook ********
OP@David **
$1,000,000 USD Minimum within one year, right?David ***
@Brook *******
yes that's what I just say as alternativeGarrett ***********
@Brook *******
Oh, I think David meant open a business and get a Non-B from the business, as an alternative to the elite or retirement.Garrett ***********
@Br***
What?Brook ********
OP@Garrett **********
*************************************************
Kool *******
You mentioned marriage visa comparison, but you didn't include it in your comparison, and it is the least damaging to your earnings potential. Under it you can work. Your financial requirement is only tied up for three months, not the full year. Once you've completed it once the only paperwork that changes year to year is your bank letters, and your pictures. Everything else stays the same, unless you move. It does require two trips to immigration as there is the 30 day under consideration stamp. Also, the 90 day reporting is now on an online system that actually works, so no need for an agent doing it, unless you're so lazy you can't navigate a simply website.
Wylie *******
@Kool ******
it's also only 400k tied up for a few months, not the 800k listed.Brook ********
OP@Kool ******
Again, I have included agent fees to try to make the comparison apples to apples.Kool *******
@Brook *******
if you are doing it legally all an agent can do is help you get all the documents, and then stand in line for you at immigration. You still must physically be there to get your visa/extension, except for the Elite visa. All the agent is really doing after the first time is holding your hand. The agent can not get your bank letters, and new pictures, for you, and that is all that changes after the first time. If it is worth about US$200 for someone to stand in line for you, then with that much money to waste there might be other visa options you aren't considering, and that you can actually make a profit on.Ivan ************
@Ko**
you need to go physically to immigration to extend Elite too, it's no different.
Narelle ************
For me it wasn't a cost issue - its the convenience of not having to go through the paperwork each year hoping they wont change the rules.
Todd *********
@Narelle ***********
One thing that convinced me that elite is rarely worth it, was that all Elite members who were out of the country at lockdown, were not permitted back in for 6 months. For sure, no other visa holders were allowed back in. But none of them pay 10k baht/month to be locked out.
Jon *****
@Todd ********
It's only just over 4k bahts per monthJon *****
@Todd ********
Correct but for 400k more you get 20 yearsTodd *********
@Jon ********
depends. 60 months for 600k looks to the main deal right now. That's 10k a month.Narelle ************
@Todd ********
so did retirees. It was frustrating sure - it took me nearly 8 months by the time I made it back. But at least they let us in. Many countries like Australia had total bans. It’s all subjective I know.Narelle ************
@Todd ********
so did retirees. It was frustrating sure - it took me nearly 8 months by the time I made it back. But at least they let us in. Many countries like Australia had total bans. It’s all subjective I know.Todd *********
@Narelle ***********
yes, as i mentioned. But it didn't cost them 10k baht monthly to be locked out. Only a few countries like Aus and NZ went completely mental locking people in or out fortunately and others remained wide open. I saw quite clearly what was happening then and came to Thailand before things locked down. Hopefully people will have a little more foresight next time. But if i am paying a large premium for a service like Thai Elite, i would expect higher level of effort to ensure access to using it.
Wayne ********
exactly going down to immigration with all the correct paper work and being told no its wrong we need this now..... it takes the hassle out of living here ..
Narelle ************
@Wayne *******
it’s a luxury for sure but I really enjoy the peace of mind.Brook ********
OP@Narelle ***********
Elite is subject to change at any time.Ivan ************
@Br***
I think the point with Elite, you have what you bought, whether that is 5 or 20 or 30 years or lifetime.With retirement, you only have at maximum a year, until your next extension.
This doesn't mean I think it's worth it for someone who qualifies for retirement, I don't, in general. It's expensive. But this is a difference, that you know you have a visa for that period with Elite. With retirement, you don't have anything beyond a year.
Narelle ************
@Brook *******
Not by comparison. There have been very minor changes over the years.Narelle ************
Oh and the changes generally have applied to new members. Existing members keep the terms they joined on.
Bobby ********
Lost investment income on the 800,000 baht. Perhaps also include calculations for the 65k/month method. Also any agent fees are discretionary. Most people do their own extensions and online 90-day reporting.
Garrett ***********
@Bobby *******
Lost investment income would apply to the elite visa also.Brook ********
OP@Bobby *******
Thanks for the reply. Lost investment income added to 800k THB.
I’m trying to make as much of an apples to apples investment as possible.
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