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Is an investor visa a better option than an Elite visa for expats in Thailand?

Investor VisaElite VisaVisa ComparisonThai Visa RulesInvestment RequirementsThai ImmigrationNon-Immigrant VisasSmart Visa
Apr 20, 2021
4 years ago
Rahul ******
ORIGINAL POSTER
Would an investor visa make more sense than an Elite visa which is a sunk cost?
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TLDR : Answer Summary
The discussion revolves around comparing the investor visa and the Elite visa for expats in Thailand. The investor visa, which requires a minimum investment of 10 million baht, is seen as a more financially advantageous option since the investment can be returned, providing potential profit upon sale. In contrast, the Elite visa entails a one-time, non-refundable fee of 1 million baht, offering no tangible return. The viability of the investor visa is further considered in terms of its limitations on investment options and the potential to accumulate permanent residency, which is not available through the Elite visa. Some participants recommend looking into the Smart visa for those interested in starting a business in Thailand.
Ivan ************
The problem with the investment visa is the very, very limited number of things you can invest in, most of which (like sticking it in a bank paying next to zero interest, or Thai government bonds) are not very appealing. You can't just invest in a random company or business you start yourself, you can't invest in the Thai stock market. If you could invest in basically anything in Thailand with that 10m, it would be a lot more appealing, but you can't.

I think for most people it comes down to, is there a condo (new build in participating project only) for 10m that appeals to you, that you'd probably be happy to buy anyway. If that is true, that's the one circumstance that could make sense. And even there, I'd think it could be easy to overpay for that by 500k-1m, which is the cost of an Elite visa.

If you actually wanted to "invest" in Thailand in a more entrepreneurial way, the Smart visas are likely a better option, the investment category starts at 5m but there is also a "startup" category with much lower requirements (start 600k), if you actually want to start something in one of their targeted industries (and "digital" is one of those, so this could suit).

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4 years ago
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Tod *********
nope
4 years ago
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Ivan ************
If you are considering sticking 10m in a savings account paying next to zero interest, you need to consider the opportunity cost of what you might make on it otherwise. That's likely a lot more than the cost of the Elite visa. 5% return (conservative) would be 500k in the first year alone, which is almost the cheaper Elite visa. Over 20 years at 5% that 10m would become 27m which is many times the cost of the Elite. If we took the long-term average return of the S&P500, it would have become 67m.

I agree the one scenario that could make sense is if there was a specific new build condo you wanted to buy anyway, to live in. But even then I think it could be easy to overpay by 500k-1m, given how limited the options are.

OP wants to start a business, which doesn't "count" for the purposes of investment for this visa.
4 years ago
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Garrett ***********
@T**
 Wrong
4 years ago
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Tod *********
@Gar****
 and do you have any idea the hoop jumping you do so you can get the 10 million baht investment visa?

Do you know the amount of funds you need frozen and/or the limitations on what you can or can't do with that money or the approved investments?
4 years ago
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Garrett ***********
@T**
 Basically a condo or a government savings account. Everything in Thailand has hoops to jump through. The point is though if you're willing to invest in Thailand, I'd rather have my funds tied up and keep them, than not have them at all.

I do think the investment option was more attractive at 3m baht as opposed to 10m though.
4 years ago
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Tod *********
@Gar****
 I know a couple people still grandfathered in on the 3 million baht plan to this very day. It was a far more attractive plan back then.
4 years ago
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Kool *******
@Tod ********
 under the old investment visa you only had to report every 3 years, and were allowed to Own one Rai of land to build your house on, but only in certain gated developments.
4 years ago
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Tod *********
@Kool ******
 yet I never ever saw one foreigner actually get that "buy one rai" program they used to tout
4 years ago
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Kool *******
@Tod ********
 it was common with Japanese executives. Toyota, Nikon, Canon, and others used it, and all in the same gated development. From my understanding it was pretty cliquish.
4 years ago
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Ivan ************
@Ko**
 that land ownership thing was also part of the original Elite visa, but it was found in conflict with Thai law on land ownership and rescinded.

What might have been proposed 20 years ago isn't really relevant to OP looking at it today.
4 years ago
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Kool *******
@Ivan ***********
 here's another thing a potential long term expat has to consider between an investment, and an Elite visa. Under the investment visa, after the correct amount of time, and meeting the other requirements, like learning Thai, you can qualify for permanent residency. Under the Elite visa permanent residency is never possible.
4 years ago
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Ivan ************
@Ko**
 it's not, no. But then the vast, vast majority of people on non-immigrant visas don't go on to get PR anyway, although it is theoretically possible. If you had your heart set on that, Elite would not be the visa for you.
4 years ago
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Kool *******
@Ivan ***********
 the vast majority have no clue at all. Why most don't try for PR is the cost. Besides the language requirement, the application fee is bt7500+, and most stop there in their advice, not even realizing that when you are approved the fee is bt195,000+, unless you are married to a Thai, then it is bt100k cheaper. That cost stops most everyone from even considering it, even though you never have to do a visa extension, or a 90 day report again.
4 years ago
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Kool *******
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Jeremy ********
It’s roughly $30k for 20 years or $1,500 a year...if you were to try to stay here for that long at that cost point it would not workout at all... travel, visa costs, accommodations while traveling, not knowing if you will be granted the follow on visa, not knowing if the immigration will accept the follow on visa you obtained from the Royal thai embassy, 30 day visa extensions... it’s more Peace of mind than anything
4 years ago
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Terary **********
I did the the back-to-back tourist visa thing. They are similar costs, provided you will avail of the total duration of the visa (5 or 10 years). The cheapest method of back-to-back tourist visa is probably about 400 - 500 year. I dont think anybody wants to do this (bus to nearst border spend the night get visa come back).

I elected to travel to different places every time I needed a new visa (Vietnam, Australia, India etc). Definitely more that $1,500 a year. But then again - I got to see more of the world.
4 years ago
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Ivan ************
It's not "$1,500 a year" because you need to pay up front for a service you get over 20 years. If you paid for it every year it would be $1,500 a year, but you don't.

You need to consider the time value of money when thinking about this and that you are paying it all up front now for a service you get the last of in 20 years. How much would that $30,000 be worth in 20 years if you hadn't paid it for the visa. That's more like the true cost.
4 years ago
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Jeremy ********
@Ivan ***********
 for Me that $1,500 world have easily went into the hands of many ST girls and probably a lot more than $1,500 a year... so I know the value of where my money goes 🤣🤣🤣
4 years ago
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Jeremy ********
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Garrett ***********
David Yeah, I'm not sure why though. The OPs questions was Investment visa over the PE. 20 years on tourist visas and border runs sounds brutal, idk why anyone would do that 😂
4 years ago
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Garrett ***********
@Jer***
 Non-O based on investment can be extended yearly, you don't have to leave the country.
4 years ago
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Garrett ***********
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Ivan ********
Investor visa is 10M and Elite visa is 1M, so its not the same.
4 years ago
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Kool *******
Ivan Dsouza Investment visa is returnable investments of a bt10million minimum, and an Elite visa is a non-refundable payment for the visa, yes, there is a big difference. The investment visa is the only visa not requiring a non-refundable payment to secure a visa, and you can work and set up a corporation under an investment visa, as many that hold an investment visa do.
4 years ago
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Ivan ************
@Ko**
 you can set up a corporation under the investment visa but investing in that corporation doesn't count for the purposes of getting the visa, that's the problem. I think Smart visa, or other BOI routes, might make more sense for OP.
4 years ago
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Ivan ********
Kool Breez I am looking at it this way. 1M is 10percent of 10M lost over 20 years which half percent per year. Not to bad a fixed amount to lose in these times. If investment turns bad like for example investing in property, stock market etc then 10 M could become anything. Also its more likely someone has 1M than 10M ready cash.
4 years ago
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Ivan ********
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Hatsaya **********
If you want to set up an IT business in Thailand, I’d suggest Smart-S visa for startups.
4 years ago
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Garrett ***********
If you have the money and are willing to invest in Thailand, investment visa is the better financial solution because you keep your money. There are limited things that qualify for investments though, condo (not houses) and government savings accounts are the 2 most common. 10m baht.
4 years ago
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Kool *******
If you can afford the investor visa, you actually get something tangible for your money, with the potential to make a profit if you leave, and sell. With the Elite visa you get nothing except your visa.
4 years ago
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Ivan ************
@Ko**
 link to something from the BOI where you can get it for investment in your own company? Every source I have says the contrary. There are other options from the BOI for that, but not this specific visa.
4 years ago
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Ivan ************
It has been around for over 20 years, I believe brought in after the 1997 crash. Used to be 3m, which you could use to buy a condo, but later upped to 10m. There are other visas you can use to invest or work in your own company including BOI sponsored companies but that's not the visa being discussed here.
4 years ago
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Kool *******
@Ivan ***********
 the BOI handles the requirements for the investment visa, or aren't you aware of that.
4 years ago
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Kool *******
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Ivan ************
@Ko**
 that sounds like you are thinking of the retirement extension. This is a different visa.
4 years ago
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Ben ********
@Kool ******
 the initial filing fees and yearly compliance costs associated with running a business, filing taxes, accounting , and employing 1-4 locals depending on your business easily exceed $1,500 a year from what I was told by a lawyer. Was he missing something?
4 years ago
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Kool *******
@Ben *******
 that cost is pretty much true with any business anywhere in the world.
4 years ago
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Ivan ************
@B**
 none of this is relevant though as you can't invest in a company you set up to qualify for the investment visa. There's only a very small number of things you can invest in to get it, basically, bank deposit, Thai government bonds, or a qualifying new build condo.

If he wants to set up a company anyway that's a separate thing, but none of this would qualify him for this visa, he'd have to "invest" in something else first to get that.
4 years ago
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Kool *******
@Ivan ***********
 actually you can invest in your own corporation, but it must be listed on the stock exchange, with publically traded stock. Quite a few executives of major corporations use this avenue of investment for the visa.
4 years ago
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Ivan ************
@Kool ******
 I don't think that's true. This is the 10m investment visa specifically, there are other visas that would let you invest in your own company. Investment visa is condo, bank deposit or state owned enterprise bond only.
4 years ago
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Kool *******
@Ivan ***********
 check with the BOI, as they handle the requirements. What the government did was add condo ownership to the investment list. Condo ownership used to be an approved element of meeting the financial requirements for a type O visa extension, but ended about 9 years ago, and was never considered since then, until it was added to the investment visa class last year. You used to be able to use the value of your condo as part of the bt800k retirement visa extension requirement.
4 years ago
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Kool *******
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Phill ******
@Kool ******
 , and a few lurks and perks .
4 years ago
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Phill ******
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Phill ******
depends if you want to work ,or not .
4 years ago
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Rahul ******
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Phill *****
 Yup. I want to set up an IT business.
4 years ago
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Phill ******
@Rahul *****
 , better way to go ,if you can afford it .
4 years ago
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Phill ******
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