Answered2 years ago
How are expats in Thailand managing their 180-day visa stamps and tax obligations?
I found the process an absolute doddle and had my DTV processed quickly. I'm not seeing much in the way of what people are doing regarding Thai tax laws, however. Are people just getting their 180 day stamp each time they enter and not worrying about it? Or are most people residing elsewhere for part of the year too?
Just intrigued to know how people are navigating this.
Good luck to all applying 🙌🏽
Just intrigued to know how people are navigating this.
Good luck to all applying 🙌🏽
Answer summary
The discussion revolves around the experiences of expats applying for and managing their Digital Nomad Visa (DTV) in Thailand, particularly focusing on tax implications. Some expats question whether they should worry about Thai tax laws while entering and leaving the country every 180 days. Various comments provide insights on tax treaties, specifics about tax residency, and personal strategies for managing finances in Thailand, with an emphasis on seeking local legal advice based on individual circumstances.
66 repliesnewest first
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Clare **********
What if you don’t have an income?
Rok ********
Personally i count the days meticulously as i do not want to acquire second tax residency; one is bad enough.
Kem *****
OP@Rok *******
haha!! I think I will be the same
Carlos *********
This is BS. The tax law has not changed, it was only a proposal. Ask an expert
Sam ******
Please delete nothing to do with dtv
Mo ******
@Sam *****
it is very interesting for DTV holdersAndy ************
@Mo *****
Interesting for ALL visa holdersMo ******
@Andy ***********
yes indeed. Was just responding to the guy who said this is not interesting or not relevant
Irina ****
Do not open a bank account here and do not transfer any money to local bank so you won't pay any tax
Luit *****************
@Irina ***
Who told you that fairy tale?
John **********
@Irina ***
that's not correct
Lachlan **********
what to "do regarding Thai tax laws"? seek your own local advice from a legal Thai based adviser about your own circumstances. and the same for any other place you reside, do business or earn money.
Andy ************
The visa has nothing to do with taxation. Taxation is based on untaxed money brought into Thailand. There's no connection
Toby *************
@Andy ***********
Incorrect the visa does have everything to do with taxation, if you actually use it as it was designed: 5 year with 6 month entries each time. Meaning over 180 days you become a tax resident. Even you think to be smart and leave 180 days elsewhere, you can still be deemed a tax resident if most of your economic activity takes place in Thailand. This is the same in the west.
People have a lot of wrong understandings about how it works, you won't be avoiding it legally.
This is all globally changing further too: soon you will remain a tax resident in the country you were 3 years a tax resident out of the most recent 10 years. This starts already in France and will then be in Europe, to align with USA. The rest follows.
The new generation with online jobs ruined it, too many escape taxes, so now they make it hard for anyone who is not in the 'old boys category' already.
Andy ************
@Toby ************
You're totally wrong. The visa was designed to get people into the country spending money to give the economy a boost. A few deluded people think the 180 days ties in with the "tax residency" which it doesn't. Most people getting DTVs will be spending a lot more than 180 days in the country each year. I'm on non-O which is a one year stamp - you might as well say that has everything to do with tax! 😆. I've been in Thailand for 23 years, and probably 16 of those as a "tax resident" but I don't pay a single baht in income tax because I'm a tax resident also of Australia, and Australia gets sole claim on my taxation. That hasn't changed, and won't change. Nothing to do with visas, everything to do with "assessable income"
Danni **********
@Andy ***********
Not correct, depends on double-tax avoidance agreement between your country and Thailand.Andy ************
@Danni *********
Actually I'm correct. TAXATION HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE VISA. End of story.Lachlan **********
@Andy ***********
correctLachlan **********
so did the legislation actually get implemented? as of 4-5 weeks ago it had not and this was all just FUD. where is this screenshot taken from?
Toby *************
@Lachlan *********
This is already known since last year and active since january 1st 2024....
Will ************
@Lachlan *********
it was implemented years ago but not enforced so it’s just a case of wait and seeLachlan **********
@Will ***********
it has not. nothing has been implemented in law and is unlikely to be. there have been several "suggestions" and numerous vaguely worded new paper articles. anyway. guess i'll leave it to people to get their own local advice for their affairs. just annoying to see this sort of stuff posted as fact.John **********
@Lachlan *********
it's not an internal memorandum, it's a revenue department order. Publicly published and in force since 1st January this yearLachlan **********
@John *********
yes I am aware of the internal memorandum. it still does not change liability - and certainly not for most DTV holders - but as I said - get your own local professional advice.John **********
@Lachlan *********
actually it has. It did not require a change in the law, rather the Thai Revenue Department has changed the way it interprets existing law. The changes were officially published as Revenue Department Orders in the Royal Gazette in September 2023 and November 2023
Ray *****
They can't even tax their own citizens. Good luck chasing down tax from immigrants. Let's see how it goes
Thierry *********
So much easier to tax foreigners... A bit like the police here when they do a road block. Who do they go for first?
Toby *************
@Ray ****
Actually they can just request all your information under the CRS system, the reason they not tax Thais is because their money is mainly cash and not comes from formal transfers. So you are entirely wrong aside from the fact that it would be a criminal jailable offense to avoid taxes. Thailand is part of these treaties since quite a few years already, that things take time, does not mean they can't or won't do it. Neither does it change your responsibility, they can still go back 5 years in time in 3 years from now so think twice.
They already requested all my info before too, from europe banks.
Ray *****
@Toby ************
you just said in your post above you remain here on tourist visas. So why would anyone request your bank details from your home country as a tourist?Toby *************
@Ray ****
Because I lived here on business visa prior for years, before leaving to europe and returning. I been here over 15 years already.I am taxed in Europe on purpose, due to this change, since jan 2024. It's not worth paying it in Thailand as you get nothing in return.
This CRS and most treaty stuff goes back to like 2017-2019 already. The Double Tax Agreements prevent me paying it double in Thailand.
Luit *****************
@Ray ****
It might be easier to tax foreigners than own citizens.Toby *************
@Luit ****************
It actually is, because we have formal transfers / transactions that they can pull up with 1 click on the CRS.Same they actually do tax all Thais that have decent jobs, we even earn more on average than those Thais, so you bet they can and will.
It just takes them some time, doesn't change lawful tax obligations meanwhile. They can go back in time in years from now too.
Toby *************
@Luit ****************
Correct but this story that foreigners keep repeating is false in the first place. Almost any formal job is taxed already before salaries are paid out and what they have left is tax free in most cases, hence almost nobody needs to report their taxes.Essentially there is no taxes when earning 20K or less if you have children too, as having kids can deduct 20K in taxes alone already.
And 90% people earn that or less. So yes you are spot on, it's very easy for them to focus on us and collect it, just takes some time to implement.
Why you think they came up with these visa's in the first place, while they said for over a decade to not want people here easily and stay here long-term for free. Because they know the taxes are the goal.
They trick people into Thailand to then tax them. This is also why i remain on tourist visa's so far.
Luit *****************
@Toby ************
And Thai people can easy say they live from help of family.A foreigner has to bring in money or work illegally, so telling you don't bring in money just does not work, you have to explain from what money you live and prove it is not taxable if you don't want to pay cash.
Getting tax money from poor Thai or extremely rich Thai will not make them popular with certain groups of citizens, but I think most Thai don't have problems with tax office get more money from foreigners.
Dave *****
@Ray ****
there’s difference between enforcement and complianceToby *************
@Dave ****
He likes to be blacklisted after having served jail + paid taxes :DKem *****
OP@Ray ****
I did wonder about this actually Ray. It's going to be very interesting to see what happens!
Łukasz *********
You should really check the double-tax avoidance agreement between your country and Thailand, and consult the tax office in the country where you currently pay taxes. There are different treaties and different rules. And not all treaties rely on the 180-day-rule. And not all income is taxed in the same way according to these treaties. As an example, in the Polish-Thai treaty, it states that you could be living in two countries and it's not the time you spend in these countries that matters but the ties you have with a given country or your nationality if you have equally strong ties with each of the countries. While you might have to file a tax return in Thailand, there is no one rule for everyone here where to pay taxes.
Andy ************
@Łukasz ********
Totally correct. The DTA applies irrespective of visa status
Fabian *******
@Łukasz ********
mate can i text you in PM? Because tax advisor in Thailand said me something differentKem *****
OPSolid advice. It sounds like you are on top of things. I hope I will be too! My main concern was that it seemed the vast majority of people (as far I can tell) seem to be choosing the option to extend their 180 days, or take a short trip and get a new 180 day stamp. I was interested to see if people taking the tax laws into account or not 🙂 thanks for your input 🙌🏽
Marco *******
Savings held before January 1st 2024 are tax exempt. As the deadline approaches, I'll check with my accountant on what to file exactly, but I for sure know already that for at least this year all of my money brought here will be tax exempt so I don't stress too much about it.
As we get closer to march everyone knows a bit more but I assume I just have to list how much money I brought here, a print of my savings per 31.12.2023 and confirm that no taxable income applies
As we get closer to march everyone knows a bit more but I assume I just have to list how much money I brought here, a print of my savings per 31.12.2023 and confirm that no taxable income applies
Mo ******
@Marco ******
saving are not taxed are they? Only revenues.Marco *******
@Mo *****
Money brought to Thailand is taxed, but when it was money from your savings last year before the law was applied then it is exemptMo ******
@Luit ****************
ok thanks! I think france signed something with ThailandLuit *****************
@Mo *****
How the money you bring in when it was not already in your account at 31-12-2024 is taxed depends on DTA between your country and Thailand. If there is no DTA you just have to pay tax in Thailand, regardless what you paid in your country.Mo ******
@Marco ******
but savings were already taxed before they became savings?
Emma ***********
Where did you apply?
Kem *****
OP@Emma **********
I'm in the UK and applied the embassy in LondonEmma ***********
@Kem ****
when did yours get approved? I’m waiting on my approval!!Kem *****
OP@Emma **********
good luck! Mine was approved a few weeks ago now. I've got some commitments here in the UK until the new year then heading out after that! Exciting times aheadEmma ***********
Well hopefully 😂😂😂
John *******
Not really a DTV question. If you were approved on the first day, Dec 31 would be 170 days in 2024
Kem *****
OP@John ******
it absolutely applies to the DTV. An awful lot of the posts I've seen have been about people doing a border run and then getting another 180 day stamp. If they intend on doing that every time for the duration of their DTV, my question is 100% validSam ******
@Kem ****
it's as valid asking how to change a tyre.This group is DTV. Not just questions about anything Thailand.
Kem *****
OP@John ******
Well, if you had replied with this in the first place that would have been a lot more helpful wouldn't it?John *******
@Kem ****
Well just highlighting that Thai tax laws impact you, regardless if you have a DTV or not. There are entire Facebook groups focused on taxes that would have better infoKem *****
OP@Sam *****
I really don't get why a couple of people are getting strung out? I thought it was relevant. Is it such a big deal? This is the first time I've posted any question on Facebook in about 5 years and I remember why I stopped using it. All I will say is, a massive thank you to everyone who helped me with something constructive and again, good luck to everyone with their futures and applications.Andy ************
@Kem ****
Your question has no validity as there is ZERO connection between ANY visa and taxation. It's that simple. This group is about the DTV, not about taxationJohn *******
@Kem ****
first off, you joined this group today. Do you have a DTV or are you one of the multiple people jaded that they bought into elite or other visas? But yes, you abide by tax laws wherever you go.Kem *****
OP@John ******
dod·dle[ˈdɒdl]
noun
BRITISH ENGLISH
informal
doddle (noun)
a very easy task:
shirty
adjective
BRITISH ENGLISH
informal
shirty (adjective) · shirtier (comparative adjective) · shirtiest (superlative adjective)
bad-tempered or annoyed:
John *******
@Kem ****
sorry, but you continue to use incorrect words, like “doodle” and “shirty”. This is why I asked for clarification.Kem *****
OP@John ******
yes I have a DTV. did you read my post properly? It clearly states I found it a doddle applying and was accepted quickly. Yes I joined the group today however I had already read through a large amount of posts as I was intrigued. My question remains valid and I see no reason for you to be shirty about it.Łukasz *********
@John ******
Some people might have been in Thailand on other visas prior to that.John *******
@Łukasz ********
well he asked if people are getting their 180 day stamps and not worrying.Activity
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