What are the implications of working remotely in Thailand on a DTV visa for a UK resident?

DTV visa Tax implications Remote work Dual Taxation Agreement Permanent Establishment Thai taxation UK taxation Immigration rules

Dec 18, 2024

4 days ago

Rosie *****

ORIGINAL POSTER

Could anybody with a DTV visa help advise, as I couldn't find the information online.

This may be specific to the UK, as I am unsure of the laws that other countries have.

The UK seems to have a law that you cannot work outside of the country for more than 180 days per year. My company is fine with me working anywhere in the world, but their concern is taxes, and that they will be required to pay foreign taxes, or that we will break some laws by doing this.

I currently (and will continue to) pay taxes in the UK as I am a resident there, but does anybody know if there are implications for me working abroad, or any steps myself and my company would need to take.

Thank you very much

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TLDR : Answer Summary

The discussion focuses on the tax implications for a UK resident holding a DTV visa in Thailand who wishes to work remotely. Key points include concerns about Permanent Establishment, which could expose the UK company to Thai corporation tax if the individual engages in habitual business activities in Thailand. It notes that spending over 180 days in Thailand could render one a tax resident, necessitating tax filings in accordance with Thai revenue laws. The UK and Thailand have a Dual Taxation Agreement that may impact tax obligations. Participants suggest consulting the HMRC website and exploring options to establish non-residency status in the UK for tax purposes.

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Robert ************

There's a form your accounts dept. can fill out making you Non-UK resident for tax purposes. You then pay no income tax on UK earnings (you do still pay on unearned income, investments etc). After a year or so, you can also opt out of national insurance payments if you want.

You will have to meet the statutory residence test rule, limiting the amount of days you can stay in the UK each year....it's all online.

4 days ago

Tony ********

@Robert ***********

pretty sure this is only where you will be tax resident in a country that has a global tax regime. As Thailand is a remitence based system the UK gov are reluctant to issue a tax exempt code. Eg you earn 100k in uk, pay no tax, only move 25k to Thailand and pay tax on 25k, you've got 75k tax free if you spend that not in Thailand, which isn't acceptable.

3 days ago

Robert ************

@Tony *******

Nope.

You become non-resident for tax purposes in the UK and then up to you where you live and pay tax.

I've been tax non-resident for many years, at least a decade of which I was paid directly from London, into a UK bank account, tax free.

3 days ago

Tony ********

@Robert ***********

but to that originally you had to declare which country you would be living, and the expectation is you would pay tax for the amount earned in the new country of tax residence. This is acceptable for countries on global tax system, not for countries on remitence tax systems. If you've recently moved to Thailand from a third country you probably need to consult a tax advisor to understand the implications of the move on your tax status. If Thailand moves to a global tax system (being discussed) everything works as you said and we can elect to opt out of at source taxing in the UK, and elect to pay all the taxes in Thailand if there is an advantage.

3 days ago

Robert ************

@Tony *******

It just isn't like that Tony.

There is an expectation you will pay tax somewhere, but this isn't the business of HMRC.

My UK tax code and those of my colleagues working in Thailand ( I was Cambodia based) was NT - no tax.

If anyone is statutory non-resident in the UK and paying tax to HMRC on a UK salary then then they shouldn't be, regardless of where they live.

For clarity, this was a huge City firm who knew what they were doing.

3 days ago

Tony ********

@Robert ***********

my own experience in Thailand, was that i continued to pay uk tax via paye and my employers tax consultants kpmg yearly managed the tax returns in both countries, claiming back 100% of uk tax and settling the Thai tax bill on earnings not remitence.

3 days ago

Reply to

Tony ********

Rosie *****

ORIGINAL POSTER

@Robert ***********

Great information, I never knew about this, thank you

3 days ago

Robert ************

@Rosie ****

It's a cracker. I paid no tax on a UK salary for years. Do investigate the statutory residence test though. I think you can still spend around 90 days a year in the UK, and more some years, but an average number over a certain number of years. I can't remember the exact details.

If you spend fewer than 180 days anywhere you are essentially tax free. Noice.

3 days ago

Reply to

Robert ************

Tim *********

Thai law determines you are a tax resident if you stay 180 days within a calendar year. That is consistent with most other countries. If you become a tax resident in Thailand, the law requires you to file a tax return by April after the year ends.

The UK has a Dual Taxation Agreement with Thailand, which exempts government pensions from Thai income tax, but all other income you bring into Thailand is tax assessable. Thai tax bands allow only 150k baht (£3.3k) free of tax, whereas UK allows £12,570. So, although you can deduct UK tax paid from the Thai tax payable, there may still be a balance owing to the Thai Revenue.

4 days ago

Andy ************

@Tim ********

Not quite true. People was stay 180 are deemed "tax residents" but are only required to file a tax return if they have assessable income. This law hasn't changed in the 20 odd years I've been here - it's always been a requirement

2 days ago

Tim *********

@Andy ***********

Previously it was applied only to earnings in Thailand, which most people on the most popular long term visas would not have. From 1 January 2024 it will be applied to all money brought into Thailand, which will be assessable for the first time although, if you can show it was received prior to 2024, it will be exempt from Thai income tax. If it is liable to Thai income tax, you may be able to rely on a DTA between Thailand and your country to reduce your liability by the amount of tax already paid in your home country.

2 days ago

Andy ************

@Tim ********

It's always been that case. 180 days in the country you're deemed a tax resident, and any money brought into Thailand has been subject to Thai tax. That hasn't changed. However, the requirement to complete a tax return is only for assessable personal income. For foreigners there are so many situations where money brought into Thailand is not assessable. In these cases a tax return is not required

2 days ago

Reply to

Andy ************

Andy **********

They are concerned about Permanent Establishment, which means you being in Thailand makes them liable to Thai corporation tax. This is defined in the UK Thai tax treaty. It all depends if there is any risk that you are involved in any business with a Thai entity or your employer does any business with a Thai entity. It might mean your career prospects become limited as you won't be able to do certain things. I'm a director of research for instance, I'm not in sales, but I may have to represent the company in a legal sense. The treaty will refer to if your task is "habitual" which is a bit fuzzy. If PE, the Thai government can ask for audited accounts or risk a fine of 5% on global revenue. DTV is a tourist visa. Getting a LTR might be more professional view. Your salary should be more than $80k. But if you are postgraduate, then only $40. And LTR is 10 years. And you are never liable to Thai income tax ever.. At least that's what BOI says. If your job is strictly silod from sales, then PE maybe not an issue. Your company might not do sales in Thailand, but never say never, especially as the UK has a road map with Thailand to improve trade.

4 days ago

Rosie *****

ORIGINAL POSTER

@Andy *********

My company is a non-profit in the UK supporting people in the UK into work, so I highly doubt they would work in Thailand, but it's not impossible.

I don't plan to establish permanent residency, thank you for your help

3 days ago

Andy **********

Any professional organisation's lawyers would rightfully ask questions about that. Its unlikely in your case. But your employer might be concerned about an administrative burden placed having to prove each year the company has no Thai income. I've asked around and it's not clear even yo tax professionals

3 days ago

Rosie *****

ORIGINAL POSTER

@Andy *********

For sure, especially with this new visa, there's a lot of confusion. It might just be easier to switch to a contractor role, then it all falls on me

3 days ago

Andy **********

@Rosie ****

Something to be aware of is working conditions. You no.longer have uk working rights. That might not be a problem if your employer is cool. Contractors basically have no rights, and it will be tough to be in Thailand, on a visa that's related to your employment status, and suddenly out of work. I know many contractors set up their own limited company. That might be worth doing now, if you are allowed to, and getting it bedded in.

3 days ago

Reply to

Andy **********

@Rosie ****

it's not permanent residency but permanent establishment, a completely different thing

3 days ago

Rosie *****

ORIGINAL POSTER

@Andy *********

Ah okay, i understand, I would still be returning to the UK regularly and keeping my GP, bank, etc

3 days ago

Reply to

Rosie *****

Graeme ******

Suggest you have a look at the hmrc website in the uk. The website will give you information on staying out of the country for 180 days or more. Yes there is an impact on you if you stay out side of the uk it doesn't matter if you work or not. For example you loose the ability to have a uk GP, can loose access to a uk bank account etc. You will become a tax resident of thailand if you stay longer than 180 days within their tax year which is January to January. Uk and thailand have a dual tax treaty which can reduce or mitigate taxes in thailand if you pay tax in the uk. I believe the tax burden is on you not your company if you work remotely I.e. stay in thailand but work for your uk based company online I.e. no work inside thailand.

4 days ago

Rosie *****

ORIGINAL POSTER

@Graeme *****

i've been out of the UK 2 years (not in Thailand) but I didn't lose any of those things, maybe I was just lucky.

Really helpful information about the taxes, thank you

3 days ago

Reply to

Rosie *****

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