Can I register as a tax resident in Thailand while on a tourist visa?

Apr 13, 2021
4 years ago
Ivor ******
ORIGINAL POSTER
I have been reading up on tax residency in Thailand. From what I can find you need to be in the country for 180 days to be considered a tax resident.

I have definitely done that for a few previous years, but I was on tourist visas.

Is it possible to register as a tax resident in Thailand if you are on tourist visas?

I did not earn income in Thailand but I would prefer to pay tax in Thailand.
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TLDR : Answer Summary
The conversation revolves around the requirements for being considered a tax resident in Thailand, specifically if one can register as a tax resident while on a tourist visa. The general understanding is that to be classified as a tax resident, you need to stay in Thailand for at least 180 days. There are conflicting opinions on whether it's possible to obtain a tax ID and file taxes on a tourist visa. While some say that it is legally feasible to register for a tax ID and file, others warn that tax obligations depend on the source of income and residency status, suggesting that without earning income in Thailand, tax liabilities may not apply. It's also noted that for tax purposes, different countries have varying rules, especially if one has income from abroad.
Sander ****************
That is correct. To get a tax ID last I heard they advise to open a local bank account which will give you one automatically. Thailand elite visa includes a bank account.

Once you do and you spend 180 days per year in Thailand, you qualify as tax resident, which means you don't pay any taxes on income from a foreign source. From what I've read this isn't a foreign vs local sourced distinction as in most other countries (as in in which country were you when you worked for that money), but rather if the money enters Thailand or not, which is a huge advantage (most other countries with territorial tax systems do tax locally sourced income, even if it doesn't enter the country).

The bigger issue is your country of origin and the country were you earned that income, because both will be interested to tax you. Many countries have some unclear rules you need to comply with before they consider you as having moved to another country (which can be having a long term residency permit, spending minimum 2 to 5 years in said country, not having any attachments in your country of origin...).
Alexander *****
@Sander ***************
I got all excited and called Bangkok Bank where I have an account to confirm. Sadly, they said they don't issue Tax ID numbers with bank accounts.
Sander ****************
@Alexander ****
from what I've read different banks and even different branches will have wildly different policies. I suspect it's more a matter of not wanting rather than not being able to help, and you might get lucky if you keep trying. Then again this was information from before the pandemic, maybe things have changed now but I doubt that.
Charles *********
It’s easy to NOT spend more than 90 days per year, and not have a home, in your country of original fiscal residence but it’s better to show your proper legal residence in Thailand as explained above,..🙏🙏 once you have done this your WORLDWIDE income is non taxable in Thailand
Carlo **********
Behave yourself,any spare dosh throw it this way mate.
Andy **********
WTF!?!?
Paul ********
What a Hero pay Tax Really
Charles *********
If you are over 50 get a retirement visa and become fiscally resident in Thailand - then you pay NO tax on your worldwide income
Bobby ********
Charles Marques. Haha! If only.....
Max *******
If you have funds in a Thai Bank you will pay 15% on any interest earned. When you pay immigration for anything you have done you are paying Tax.
Paul *******
If you smoke and drink or have a car you paid tax already
Bobby ********
Paul Kruse. You pay 7% VAT on everything you buy. If you go out for dinner tonight and spend about 500 baht, you've paid 35 baht in tax. If you go shopping in the supermarket and spend a thousand baht, you've paid 70 baht in tax. If you've got a savings account in the bank you pay a witholding tax on your interest. And that's the same in just about every other country you visit. However, it does not really make you a "taxpayer"
Paul *******
@Bobby *******
I get what you're saying but he seemed like he really wanted to help thailand by paying taxes I was making sure he was aware of those particular taxes we all pay
Bobby ********
@Paul ******
. I think he wants to help himself by paying lower taxes, but it doesn't work that way. Income earned in another country is still assessed in that country in the first instance.
Paul *******
Paul *******
@Bobby *******
retail tax is tax
Jeff **********
Tax issues are a complicated thing. please read the billateral Tax agreement between your home country and Thailand
Peter *********
Are you right in the head 5555
Ivor ******
ORIGINAL POSTER
Thanks for all the helpful comments. I learnt quite a bit. I also found this article based on
@Charles *******
comment. Might be useful to someone who is in the position I described above.
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Hope you have a good week.
Ron *******
I would like to do the same rather than paying UK tax at 40% on related earnings.

It's impossible other than being granted non domicile, in the UK. All sounds good? It isn't as you first need to be granted 'domicile' in your chosen country, and give up your passport etc and Thailand don't do that on demand.

Try somewhere in West Africa. It won't be happening here.
Darren *******
@Ron ******
even if non-dom in UK, if it's UK sourced income you'd still have to pay tax on it in the UK. It's foreign income you can elect not to pay tax on in the UK as a non-dom UK tax resident provided that you don't remit the income to the UK. I appreciate that's an incredibly simplified explanation above but that's the general gist of it.
Gooddy *******
@Darren ******
sort of correct. Letting income is liable to tax as is personal company pension. Dividend income can be exempt based on your residency status. Capital gains tax can be exempt but again depends on residency status (property excepted).
Darren *******
@Chris *****
yep, I was trying to keep it as simple as possible :)
Jeff **********
@Darren ******
this depends on billateral tax agreements between uk and thailand.
Darren *******
@Jeff *********
which part depends on the tax agreement?
Ron *******
@Darren ******
yes your right. I haven't looked for a good few years.

There are tax advantages though for the super rich....that isn't me 😂
Darren *******
@Ron ******
same 😂
Darren *******
Doesn't work like that I'm afraid. Tax is paid where your income is earned. In order for it to be taxable in Thailand you would need to remit your income to Thailand BUT doing this doesn't necessarily mean Thailand will have primary taxing rights.

The above does not take into account you are on a tourist visa, which may null and void the above anyway.
Simon **********
@Dar***
that’s not true. You are liable to pay tax where you are resident first, then under some countries laws you are also liable for any shortfall that you would have paid in the country where you were paid and/or are a citizen of. This is the case for Americans I believe. Tax exiles don’t pay tax where they earn money, they pay little or no tax in the country they reside in, hence an exile.
Darren *******
@Simon *********
nope. Take Thailand, you can be a Thai tax resident but you pay tax on Thai source income and overseas income remitted to Thailand. If you're non-resident for tax then you still pay tax in Thailand on your Thai sourced income.

If you're a UK tax resident you pay tax on UK source income and your worldwide income. If non-residenr you pay tax on UK sourced income.

Americans are different in that they're taxed in the US on their worldwide income regardless of whether they're a resident or not. They can use double tax treaties, where they are in force, to reduce their tax in the US.

By tax exile I am assuming you are referring to self employed as opposed to an actual employee? In which case yes, I agree to an extent. It will depend upon their nationality, where their business is and also just how honest they do or don't want to be.
Simon **********
@Dar***
I am a UK non tax resident, I do not pay tax to the UK on ANY of my earnings regardless of where I earn it. If I spent more than 183 days in Thailand I would be liable for Thai tax.
Bobby ********
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Darren *******
@Simon *********
not true, I am also a UK non tax resident but if I had any UK sourced income, eg rental property, then it would be taxed in the UK. It would only be deemed taxable in Thailand if I remit it into Thailand, as a Thailand tax resident.
Simon **********
@Dar***
well my accountant would beg to differ
Gooddy *******
@Simon *********
any letting income in Uk is taxed in uk irrespective of your residency status.

Same as your private UK pension, it’s taxed at source in UK
Simon **********
@Ch***
I am not sure what has led anyone to assume I have a rental income?
Andy ********
@Simon *********
I am afraid I am with
@Darren ******
and strongly suggest you get a second opinion on your tax affairs. Then sack your current accountant.
Darren *******
@Simon *********
then I suggest you get a new accountant because if your accountant is telling you that UK sourced income, eg rental income, is not taxable in the UK then he's not doing his job properly and it will be you who picks up the shit should HMRC choose to investigate your affairs.

It may be that he's using allowances and legislation to legally reduce taxable income to zero but that is very different from saying UK sourced income is not taxable in the UK. If it's this then that's fine and legal, if it's the former (paragraph above) then I suggest you find a new accountant.
Gooddy *******
@Darren ******
that’s correct, maybe his rental income is below his personal allowance but nevertheless any uk source letting income is liable to tax irrespective of residency status
Bobby ********
@Chris *****
. I think there's an assumption he's getting income from a rental property, but his income may be generated from working either offshore or online, the latter of which you cannot do legally in Thailand whilst on a tourist visa. If this is the case it's not going to work tax-wise, as it's going to be difficult to explain to the Thai authorities how he's generating income from overseas on which he wishes to pay Thai income tax whilst on a tourist visa. I think the fact that he has not responded to any of the feedback suggests a fishing expedition!
Charles ********
Yes you can get a tax number and files taxes in Thailand on a tourist visa.

It is legally required if you have taxable income...

Yes you can have taxable income without working in Thailand and everything is still legal.
Tod *********
I think what you're actually asking is can you get a "tax I/D number" as a foreigner here on a tourist visa <-(the number that tracks you for tax purposes)

And unfortunately I don't know the answer to that, BUT I bet the Dept of Revenue does and the first day they're going to be open after this Songkran holiday is Friday the 16th.

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Frédéric ******************
They give a tax payer number to any one with an official address in Thailand (even if you don't pay taxes) if you ask for it.
Ole ****
@Tod ********
it is possible to get a tax ID on a tourist visa. I got it on elite visa (which is technically tourist visa class) and a friend of mine on a 60 day visa
Gareth ********
@Tod ********
the last time I needed SCB paper bank statements printed, they had a tax ID number on them.
Tod *********
That doesn't even make sense. You don't have any income in thailand BUT you would prefer to pay tax here?

What does that even mean?
Frédéric ******************
Double taxation treaty:

If you get income in the foreign country and you are taxed in that country, you won't pay tax in Thailand.

If you get income in Thailand and you're taxed in Thailand, you won't pay tax in the other country.

The aim is to avoid being taxed twice, once the name "double taxation".

There is no treaty saying you won't pay tax in the foreign country on your foreign income if you're resident in Thailand and vice versa
Dimitri ********
@Tod ********
You are much more safe if you can prove that you paid tax in another country, when you return to your home country.
Tod *********
@Dim****
said no one that I know of :/ What are you going to pay taxes ON, you don't legally work IN thailand.
Max *********
@Tod ********
He can pay taxes on foreign source income which amounts to 0% I believe and then wouldn't have to pay on his home country
Gooddy *******
@Max ********
absolutely incorrect
Max *********
@Chris *****
It's called a double taxation treaty. It is absolutely correct. Obviously I wrote the word 'can' for a reason. It depends on his home country and his specific situation. I was purely responding to Tod's comment as a reason why the guy may have been asking the question in the first place.
Darren *******
@Max ********
no, no, and no. Income earned is taxed in the country it is earned/paid. You can't just do what you suggested, well you can but please let me know what the relevant tax authorities conclude as you'll no doubt be paying extra penalties and interest for deliberately trying to conceal stuff.
John ******
@Darren ******
incorrect. in principle if you live more than 180 days a year in thailand you COULD be taxed. Depends on where the income is coming from, if there is a treaty between the country where you eaned the money and much more. Ask a tax consultant before you are going to ask for a tax id.
Dan ********
@John *****
it's a tax 'agreement' not a treaty. A treaty generally being of benefit to one or both parties.
John ******
@Dan *******
thanks i believe you are right.but there is another word too. CONVENTION

BETWEEN

THE KINGDOM OF THAILAND

AND

THE KINGDOM OF THE NETHERLANDS

FOR THE AVOIDANCE OF DOUBLE TAXATION

AND THE PREVENTION OF FISCAL EVASION WITH

RESPECT TO TAXES ON INCOME AND ON CAPITAL COME
Darren *******
@John *****
if you're in Thailand for more than 180 days then you are only taxed in Thailand on foreign income which you remit here. If you don't bring foreign income into Thailand then it's not taxable in Thailand.

You are right that a double tax treaty can be used to either reduce tax due in Thailand or completely remove any tax due in Thailand but you'd need to remit the overseas income in order to make it taxable here.

Any income earned in Thailand would be taxable in Thailand whether you are a tax resident or not, eg employment income.
Bobby ********
Max Roberts. Some people are dreamers. Anyone seeking tax advice from a Facebook group has no concept of personal income tax.
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