Can I get a scooter endorsement in Thailand if I can't in the US before my trip?

Jun 12, 2021
3 years ago
Ruth *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
I have a bit of an unusual question. I’ve seen some discussion regarding international licenses and other issues regarding scooters, but I can’t find precisely an answer to this issue.

I have been trying to find a scooter class to get an endorsement added to my U.S. license before heading to Thailand. I found one, but they have a very bad reputation. The rest of the classes only teach on motorcycles and due to some physical limitations, I think the bikes they use would be problematic for me.

I’m wondering if it’s possible for me to get whatever lessons/certification I need once I’m in Thailand. I have not yet decided on what visa I will be entering. I may only come on a tourist visa then decide how I will extend or I may come on a retirement visa. I’m not sure if my visa type will make a difference. Any advice is appreciated.
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TLDR : Answer Summary
The user inquired about obtaining a scooter endorsement for their U.S. license before traveling to Thailand, expressing concerns about finding an appropriate class that meets their needs. Community responses discussed the importance of training, shared experiences with licensing in both the U.S. and Thailand, and noted various options for motorcycle driving courses available in Thailand, including recommendations for the Honda Training School and other local schools. The threads highlighted the distinctions and safety considerations when riding scooters in Thailand, underscoring legal requirements and practical tips.
Garrett ***********
An IDP is simply a translation of your government issued license.

You CAN take a motorbike course in Thailand that will enable you to get a motorbike license, but if you're in the US still it would be better to get it there.
George *************
I can see why they ask for an IDP even for a license that is already in English (one of the languages used in an IDP). In the US, for instance, Driver's Licenses are issued by each of the fifty states and each one's a little different, especially when it comes to something like indicating a motorcycle endorsement. When translated to an IDP the motorcycle endorsement is very clear, always in the same place on the IDP.

If you don't have an IDP my suggestion is that you take the time to explain where the motorcycle endorsement is specified on your driver's license when you go to the Thai DLT.
Michael ********
There are classes here, i know you looking to get prior but its type of bike you would ride here.

Honda do good classes and i believe fatboys do as well.
Ruth *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Michael *******
What I may do is attempt the motorcycle cert and if I find the bike is just too tough to handle, I will take the course in Thailand. I really appreciate the link from Zed that should help.
Michael ********
@Ruth ******
yes didnt see that quite detailed, i should do my license but I only ride around village. Truck or car for main roads
George *************
Hi Ruth,

I drive a scooter in Phuket. One of the things I love most about being in Thailand. The feeling of freedom is amazing.

But it's not without danger. To minimize the danger I went to a very good motorcycle driving course in Ft. Lauderdale, Florida before moving to Thailand. Had never been on a motorcycle before. The course is good enough that you got your motorcycle endorsement when you graduated (no need to take the state's motorcycle driving test). 3 days about $300.

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I moved to Florida before coming to Thailand for three reasons (in order of importance):

1) Establish residence in a state that didn't have a state income tax

2) Attend this particular motorcycle course and get the motorcycle endorsement on my FL driver's license.

3) Acclimatize myself to living in a hot and humid tropical climate.

Objectives 1) and 2) were achieved. Still working on 3).

Highly recommend this course. Was not like boot camp, no-drill instructors fired live ammunition over our heads as we learned how to ride motorcycles. To this day I feel totally unqualified to lead an amphibious assault team. Also, unless I fell asleep in class we never had to lift the motorcycles over our heads while standing on one foot. But I could have done it, I was much younger then.

Got a motorcycle endorsement added to my Florida Driver's Licence. Went to AAA got my International Driver Permit (showing my endorsements for car and motorcycle).

Arrived in Thailand. Walked around on the street for one month observing traffic. Learned everything I could about crossing the street by following old dogs. Think about it. Rented a scooter (Honda Click). Went out in the countryside and drove around and around for several days until I was comfortable enough to drive in traffic. Initially, wouldn't drive at night, wouldn't drive in the rain, wouldn't drive in heavy traffic, or busy times of the day. Gradually, started doing all those things.

As foreign driver's license and international driving permit are only good for driving in Thailand for 3 months, I went to the Land Transport Office and got my Thai car and motorcycle driver's licenses based on my foreign license. Had to watch a video, did not have to take the written test, did not have to take a practical driving test, did have to take physical color recognition and reaction time tests. Got both car and motorcycle driver's licenses.

Some final random comments:

I drive an automatic Honda Click. All the time I would have to spend on shifting manually I use to watch the environment around me in an effort not to be killed. I need every second of that extra time the automatic saves me. Maybe some don't.

A man robs a bank and isn't caught by the police. Strangely, the lesson I draw from this isn't that robbing banks is legal. I feel the same way about people driving scooters without a motorcycle license. You might not get caught but what you're doing sure isn't legal no matter how much you fool yourself it is. You might never be caught, but on the other hand, you might be paying 1,000 baht to the boys in brown every time they catch you driving without a motorcycle driving license. Not to mention that without being a legal driver you've just given your insurance company a get-out-of-paying-for-your-accident card. Whether they play that card or not is up to them.

In the time some people spend arguing about whether you need an International Driving Permit you could have already got an International Driving Permit. Less than $15. Saves hours of your time having to educate the nice lady at the Land Transport Office about how you don't really need one and explaining to her the finer points of the Geneva Convention. Time much better spent getting a massage.

The average 10-year-old Thai child has more experience riding motorcycles than I do or ever will.

Get yourself a decent full-face motorcycle helmet and wear it always. When on the motorcycle, I mean.

Been riding a scooter in Thailand for 8 years and having a great time. Good wishes and good luck!
Ruth *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
@George ************
You made me laugh so hard in your description of legalities. I feel exactly the saw way. Even within the U.S., with things that “don’t matter”, I see no point in skirting the law. I keep within the law for my own sense of right and wrong as well as peace of mind. Don’t even get me started on the weird looks I got in Florida, not to mention with contractors. However, I will tell you that when I did my home remodels (myself), it got to the point where inspectors barely even looked at my work. Lol. It definitely saved time.

Anyway, it’s funny that you bring up So. Florida, because I’ve been considering going there. I need to return to wrap-up some business in Sept/Oct, immediately before I hope to return to Thailand (great timing for lessons, eh?). I had not yet transferred my licensed to the state where I’ve been for a year and the DMV said I do not need to if I am a temporary resident. I was seriously considering doing the lessons there instead. The problem is still lifting a larger motorcycle and I’m not talking about over my head 🙂. Think of someone with a hernia…it would be similar (not exactly the same). I had previously spoken to a lovely woman in West Palm Beach and she said they taught on Harleys. I just don’t think I could handle lift one if it fell and I know that’s part of the testing. HOWEVER, she also said they have a sister store here and I could go in to see what my limitations are.

Thank you for all the great advice. I agree on every point. I will look into that school.
George *************
Oh, one other license thing. If you're planning on moving to Thailand for the long haul it might be a good idea to get a new Florida License as I believe Florida is one of those states that allows you to renew your license online the first time. In other words, I think it would be possible to keep your Florida driving license valid for a long time without having to travel back to the state. I might be wrong about this but it's what I remember from doing the research at the time.
Ruth *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
@George ************
It’s good through 2026, but I’m going to pm you in a bit about some other questions, if you don’t mind. They’re not specific to Thailand, so they don’t seem appropriate for the group.
George *************
@Ruth ******
Yeah, that's fine. But I'm about to go to sleep so it may be 8 hours or so before I get around to answering.
George *************
@Ruth ******
I can't actually remember what I trained on but I would definitely have remembered if they were Harleys as my brother is specifically into big Harleys. I did find this FAQ on the site of the place I recommended above:

// Do I need to bring a motorcycle to the course?

No. Motorcycles will be provided for you at your designated training site. Scooters are available at select locations and ONLY by reserving in advance. You must contact our call center to arrange using your own scooter. 877.308.7246

// What kind of motorcycles are used for the class?

We offer a variety of motorcycles to train with. Our fleet consist of a variety of motorcycles: Suzuki TU250, Honda Nighthawk 250cc, Honda Rebel 250cc, Honda Elite 80cc (scooter), Suzuki GZ250cc, Kawasaki Eliminator 125cc, Suzuki DR200cc, Yamaha Virago 250cc, Buell Blast 500cc, Kymco Agility 125 (scooter)

--
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Now, I know we weren't using scooters and we weren't using Harleys so I'm guessing it was one of the little 250cc models. Bigger than a scooter, but would be considered a baby-sized motorcycle, I think. Anyway, I've never had a hernia so probably don't know exactly what the concerns are, but in general, you're not manhandling the bikes in any way during the class.

If it were possible (and one of the FAQs above suggest it would be) you can arrange to take the class on a scooter. Another thing to consider is that Thai kids really do drive themselves to school when they are like 10 years old. If you're doing it right, you're never really tossing the bike around much. The only reason I can think you would ever need to lift a scooter is when putting it up on the center kickstand, rather than using the side kickstand.

The Honda Click I ride is 125cc, most of the typical scooters you see in Thailand are the same, I think.

Anyway, hope this helps. I really did enjoy the class. Nice people.
Zed ********
The step-by-step info you need us here. Including the test questions and the training schools.
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Ruth *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Zed *******
thank you so much.
George *************
@Zed *******
That is a great resource with excellent information.
Terary **********
Here, in Thailand. Scooters are call motorcycles.. Motorcycles are called big bikes.

License are not strictly necessary for scooters (motorcycle/s). I have been driving them six or seven years and haven't had any issues. However... I am sure the law maybe requires a license? I am not sure. People drive them anyway. On occasion you will get stopped and have to pay a fine (or tea money). That will happen to you to you for being a foreigner anyway. Fine in Pattaya is $15/US.

If you feel like being a rebel and getting a motorcycle license (scooter) AND you are unable to get a Motorcycle license in the US, your only other option is to get it here.
Ruth *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Terary *********
I’ve always been a rebel in reverse 🙂.
David ***********
It's easer to learn hospital procedure
Andrew ********
Thailand is NO PLACE to learn bike skills.
Sid *******
There is Honda Training School in Chiang Mai also. I’m sure they accept Foreign students as I see people recommending them in the Chiang Mai Expat Forums all the time to people wanting to get licensed. I think it is a 2 day course and they can issue the License. They also have bikes available.
Ruth *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Sid ******
Thank you. I will see if I can find them online and contact them. Chiang Mai is where I plan to land first.
Kool *******
In most every US state I have been in, the local DMV is responsible for issuing your motorcycle endorsement on your driver's license after you pass their driving and written test. There are no private businesses that can issue you an endorsement in the US. If you speak Thai, the main Honda dealership has motorcycle driving classes in Bangkok.
Ruth *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Kool ******
good point about the language. I’m just starting my studies (and it’s rough), so that is definitely a factor.
Michael ********
@Ruth ******
fatboys does courses in English
เอ็ดเวิร์ด *******
If you want to get an IDP to drive a bike here, my experience, I went to AAA in America and was told I would need a USA motorcycle license. I opted to get an automobile IDP, but when I showed it at a police traffic stop in Chiang Mai I was busted and had to pay the fine.
Ruth *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
@เอ็ดเวิร์ด ******
I do plan to get an IDP to carry with the license. I'm just trying to figure out what to do specifically about the scooter issue.
Frédéric ******************
@เอ็ดเวิร์ด ******
An IDP is nothing more than a copy of a national driving license with translation in several languages. It should be used together with the national license. If you ride a scoot with a car license, of course the police will give you a fine.
Ruth *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Frédéric ****************
An IDP is also an authorization to drive internationally. You're basically really just informing that you plan to drive out of country. It's best to have it if something goes awry.
Frédéric ******************
@Ruth ******
It's the host country that requests for an IDP while driving on their roads. Your native country doesn't authorize anything, they just provide you with the document as per the international road transportation agreement.
Ruth *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Frédéric ****************
I’m sorry. I should have been clearer. Yes, it is he host country that determines whether they accept the IDP. However, there are ramifications in one’s home country if one drives without an IDP in a country that does not accept it (things like whether one’s travel insurance is void, etc.). Anyway, doesn’t really matter…I plan to get it. Enough said 🙂.
Frédéric ******************
@Ruth ******
All countries that are member of the U.N. accept the IDP. It's not whether they accept it, it's whether their laws REQUEST it or not to drive on their roads. Many legally accept national licenses if it's in a language they understand (ie. I can drive in the US and Canada with my French license and no IDP). In case of accident, the insurances will just look if you comply with local laws before paying for the damages. If the local law doesn't make an IDP mandatory, you're fine with the insurances if you don't get one.

Getting an IDP is definitely not a report to your home country authorities that you intend to drive abroad and has no legal impact at home.
Benjamin ******
>I have been trying to find a scooter class to get an endorsement added to my U.S. license before heading to Thailand.

I don't know what state you're in. MOST States have the same requirements for a "scooter" and a motorcycle. CONTACT the Motorcycle Safety Foundation at
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You do *NOT* want to learn how to ride a motorcycle/ motorscooter in Thailand. LEARN how to ride a manual motorcycle (a Ninja would be more than enough). Riding a manual motorcycle is almost the same as a scooter. The skills you learn and get drilled into your head at an MSF class *WILL* save your life.

Motorscooters ARE dangerous, and if you don't feel comfortable enough on a smaller motorcycle like a Ninja, you should NOT go on a scooter in Thailand; you'll get killed :(
Ruth *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
Robert & George - what you’ve described is precisely why I’m so desperate to get back. I need to get back to that culture where people take care of one another before I lose my own soul.

Robert - can you jump start an automatic scooter? Something to think about as I think about my plans.
Linda *********
Ruth, I'm glad you posted this. I've given up and decided to buy a car when I get there.
Benjamin ******
@Linda ********
Buying a car is much safer
Linda *********
@Benjamin *****
very expensive though.
Niclas ***********
To learn proper is good but driving like a westerner in Asia is dangerous so taking classes or instructor in the country is recommended as well. Or just find someone to go riding with when arrived.
เอ็ดเวิร์ด *******
@Niclas **********
I have to say I am a little confused by your comment. If one takes a class in Thailand then one graduates driving like Thais.......scary. LOL
เอ็ดเวิร์ด *******
I found my 20 years of whitewater kayaking experience had some positive carryover into bike riding- feeling comfortable leaning to the side and being in the moment. Mindfulness, continually monitoring your environment is necessary.
Pat *********
Not exactly true. Riding a manual motorbike for a first timer is tough, get the basics with an automatic / scooter and then take the plunge on a motorbike at some stage.

If you can drive a car manually, you'll know the clutch can be tricky at first - the clutch on a motorbike is MUCH trickier. If you're going A-B, go with am automatic / scooter.

You can get licenses in Thailand - but the Land Transport Offices are currently closed to new licenses due to State of Emergency. When they are open you're able to do your test there and get the license, you'll have to sit through a theory exam though (i believe you can do it all in one day). The practical is in a safe zone where there are no cars and it's apparently quite easy.

I'm not advising you to practice in Thailand but you're best going somewhere super quiet - islands like Koh Yao Noi where there aren't many drivers - take it slow. Most people in parts of Thailand aren't insured, in fact word on the street in Koh Samui most locals don't even own a license. You can ride around, but if you have an accident you are paying out.
Benjamin ******
@Pat ********
>Riding a manual motorbike for a first timer is tough, get the basics with an automatic / scooter and then take the plunge on a motorbike at some stage.

The MSF classes take a person step-by-step, and are designed for someone who never seen a motorcycle before, much less ride one :O I think it's a 18 hour long class, broken up into A three-hour eCourse, five hours of formal classroom activities, and ten hours of riding instruction conducted over two or three sessions, plus its knowledge and skill tests. In California, the trainers are retired CHP motorcycle officers/ wannabe drill Sargents who have no problem screaming at you if you do something wrong.
Robert ********
@Benjamin *****
I admire your efforts, but it's easier to do it here. In fact, it's easier not to do it at all. They pay much more attention to your registration sticker than license. I pull out my American, 2 years expired DL when I am pulled over and have never had a problem.
Benjamin ******
@Robert *******
>I admire your efforts, but it's easier to do it here.

It's not the legality about getting the license, but the knowledge and experience of being a rider. It *may* be easy to get the motorcycle license inside Thailand, however having a license does not replace the experience and knowledge of going through an MSF training class.

I know what I learned during my MSF class saved my life a lot in Thailand. And that knowledge is something that a license simply won't replace.
Ruth *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Benjamin *****
I don’t need a lecture about the importance of lessons. I came asking about lessons. You also weakened your argument by telling me that I can pay someone to be be abusive and treat me as CHP officers do. Given that I had one almost pull a gun on me for the horrible crime of pulling into a parking lot to take a phone call with my daughter, I’m not a big fan.

Yes, of course the state’s endorsement is the same as for a motorcycle (no, I’m not in CA), which is why most of the classes teach on them, but I have no intention of riding a Harley (the preferred ride they use for their classes). I have only half of my abdominal muscles and I think those lovey “drill instructors”, as you describe them, would have a hissy fit about my inability to lift a Harley. I don’t need to pay for that abuse.

Also, these classes are going to be INCREDIBLY expensive. I gave up my car when I was in Asia, so I need to rent a car for each of the classes and they are three days, minimum, spread out. Each day of classes is a two-day car rental at over $100/day (rental cars are crazy right now). That’s in addition to the $500-600 for the class, so I’d better be absolutely certain that these classes are gold. The one class that I said has a bad reputation seems to like to take people’s money, then just drop them out in the first hour or two. That’s not really going to help teach me or get my endorsement.

Sooooo…

For everyone else, I am not looking to skirt the system. I understand that I can “get by” without the license, but I want to learn and get licensed properly, just in Thailand, not the U.S.. That’s my question. Is that possible?

Pat - thank you for your information on the licensing offices. That’s discouraging, but maybe they’ll open by the time I get there. Yes, I do plan to get an automatic, although my last *car* was a clutch.
Robert ********
@Ruth ******
I would really recommend you rent automatic scooter here. They are so nice and easy and driving around the rural areas is beautiful and fun it will give you some great experience. Once you feel confident you can venture further and further out, eventually into the town and city. That’s the way most of us learn, I think you’ll do great.
Ruth *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Robert *******
I plan to rent an automatic, but I would still like to find lessons, if possible. Thank you for being so encouraging.
Robert ********
@Ruth ******
you’ll have a great time. Also people here will help. I had a battery go dead on my last week and a Thai guy showed me how to jump start
George *************
@Robert *******
Yep, you haven't really ridden a scooter in Thailand until you've run out of gas and had a Thai give you a stiff-leg push to the nearest gas station. And expect nothing for doing so. ;-)
Robert ********
@George ************
this is true. Unless you have had a Thai person bail you out on a scooter, you haven’t had a full experience. This is very funny because it is very true.
Ruth *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Robert *******
I love the Thai people, but pardon me if I hope I never have the privilege 😀
Robert ********
@Ruth ******
it’s not a matter of wanting it or not. At some point you’re going to have a flat tire, especially on a scooter. The tires are pretty thin compared to a bigger bike. A flat tire in Thailand is actually how I met my wife. So, they aren’t always bad. Aside from meeting my wife from an experience like this, I also have at least four or five really cool stories related to people here helping me with directions that ended up having me stay the night, with mechanical problems they ended up becoming lifelong friends etc.
George *************
@Robert *******
Yes, you *will* have flats. Luckily there's a motorcycle repair shop nearly everywhere you go. Inexpensive (usually replace the innertube), done in 10-15 minutes. Not a bad experience at all. Other than that and putting in gas, the occasional oil change, the scooters in Thailand are remarkably low maintenance.
Ruth *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Robert *******
Good to hear that you are still happy you met your wife (I often don’t hear such pleasant things said on this list). You guys are fun.
Robert ********
@Ruth ******
95% of the people you meet that are white in Thailand are people that you should avoid. Thai wives are great if they aren’t addicted to alcohol and fun times because they were met in a bar or if you don’t cheat on them. That eliminates pretty much 99% of the people in this group and that’s why they have bad experiences. The most dangerous thing you will ever find in Thailand are expats.
Ruth *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Robert *******
Yeah, I’ve picked up on that. What I’ve noticed is that the same people who complain that women take all their money also think women are for sale. Hmmm…I wonder when (if ever) they’ll realize the correlation. Anyway, I found some lovely expats while I was there, but they were all couples. I prefer hanging out with locals though (true everywhere) . I cannot wait to get back. This last year+ has been painful after spending ~2 years in Asia.
Robert ********
@Ruth ******
I'm glad you met some nice friends. My ratio for real friends is about 1 out of 10. The 9 will offer me investment opportunities, will want to waste a lot of time picking my brain about experience and business here. One of the worse ones I documented on video, a "friend" tricked me into a bad situation:
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I think in Chiang Mai for example, there is a great community of expats and digital nomads. I am just really far away from that :)
Ruth *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Robert *******
I lived in Florida. I already know not to trust anyone :-) (I'm only half kidding). You're wife seems really cool.
George *************
@Ruth ******
yeah, running out of gas is always a failure in planning, but it happens ;-)
Benjamin ******
@Ruth ******
As they say in Thailand, "up to you". However, remember too...

1. Thailand has one of the highest rates of motorcycle deaths in the world.
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*****
82/thailand-tops-asean-road-death-table

2. There is no free medical care in Thailand. If you go to the hospital, you will stay in the hospital until you get the bills paid.

3. Children learn how to ride a motorcycle from a young age; they watch the parents ride, they learn how to ride on the small sois, then they go on the open road; you won't have that experience.

4. Whatever your experience is with the CHP, get over it. Whining won't get you anywhere in Thailand.

Good luck! You'll need it.
Robert ********
@Benjamin *****
That's great. You can go to a parking lot and ride around cones and have a piece of paper that says you know how to ride a bike. Or, you can ride slowly around rural villages, gain confidence go to town, gain confidence drive in a city.

I never rode a scooter or motorcycle in my life before coming to Thailand and I rented one in Udon Thani on my first Thai trip. I rode in a small village called Amphoe Phen, outside of town. After a week, I started venturing into the city and slowly my world expanded. It was a blast and to this day having lived in Thailand 4 years now, it was some of the most fun I ever had.

If you need a MSF class or want it, it's a great idea to gain some confidence and learn to shift gears if you are not buying an auto scooter. My point is you don't LEGALLY need it here. In 4 years I have put about 100K on my bikes, even though I now have a truck also and now I ride large bikes and if you think a class will prepare you for riding a bike in Thailand. I PROMISE you it WILL NOT. There is no law here, effectively. You need to be a passenger in cars, pay attention and immerse yourself. Then, work your way up riding bikes. That's it. I've done it, you haven't. So you don't need to tell me what's up. I'm here. If you don't want to die, you will have to learn how things work in Asia and it's a progression in learning and if you do it right, it's fun.
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Kool *******
@Robert *******
there are exceptions to everything in life, as your experience points out. For most every other person, and especially on the streets in Bangkok, Thailand is not the place to first learn to ride, if you have a choice, but, as your experiences point out there are exceptions to everything in life.
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