What should British expats know about State Pension Life Certificates and DWP communications?

Hathaway *************

Excuse my ignorance but at 65 I'm not claiming yet but what is a "life certificate"?

Nelly ******

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776e94bb

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18ee90/Life_Certificate.pdf

Nelly ******

Witnesses who can sign a Life Certificate

The person who witnesses the Life Certificate should not be related to you by birth or marriage, and should not live at the same address as you.

People who can witness a Life Certificate are:

a member of the police force

a teacher or lecturer

an officer of a bank authorised to sign documents on its behalf

a doctor, surgeon, dentist, nurse, pharmacist or optician registered under the law of the country where the declaration is made

a care or residential home manager (if customer is resident)

a barrister, solicitor or advocate authorised to practice in the country where the declaration is made

paralegal (certified paralegal, qualified paralegal, or associate member of the Institute of Paralegals)

a Notary Public or any other person allowed to administer oaths in the country where the declaration is made (commissioner for oaths)

a civil servant or government employee

a member of the Foreign Service of the United Kingdom or HM Overseas Civil Service or a British Diplomatic or Consular Officer

a councillor, for example local or county

a local government officer

a Member of Parliament

a magistrate or Justice of the Peace

a minister of a recognised religion

Hathaway *************

So download, print, get signed and post to DWP prior to attaining state pensionable age? Or do I wait until after birthday, sorry to sound dumb but I've never been this old before.

Hathaway *************

@Nelly *****

thankyou.

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Hathaway *************

Nelly ******

@Hathaway ************

A Life Certificate is used by the Department for Work and Pensions to check that a person living outside the UK can still get a UK State Pension.

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Nelly ******

Peter **********

I worked as an assistant auditor for the predecessor of PWC. Back in 1985 or something alike, the firm had a large insurance company as new clients.

They asked me to join their EDP audit department and I managed to connect one of the first IBM PCs remotely to the data center of the client. All with permission, of course.

We sampled 1% of their pension payments to people above the age of 80 and requested Life Certificates. Lots of payments went to Indonesia, a former Dutch colony.

Turns out many had deceased but the family happily brought the monthly checks to the local postal office. They saved approx 100,000 guilders per month on our sample only. In 1985!

Then they installed procedures to get regular Life Certificates. I don’t know the final numbers but it must have been huge!

It never reached the news. 😉

Mark *********

ORIGINAL POSTER

@Peter *********

Wow. Yep the basis for fraudulence is doing nothing. My guess is people are more open to that rather than taking a positive fraudulent action.

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Mark *********

Michael *******

Presumably they dont want to be paying out to deceased folks, fairly reasonable - by law executor of estate is supposed to notify them.

Mark *********

ORIGINAL POSTER

@Michael ******

Yes that is absolutely stated as the intent. Though I think there may have been more than a little political intent in setting up the new office in Wolverhamptom. Yes a town desperately needing jobs but, arguably, the political intent was Robert Jenrick. Whatever, it is what it is and causes me, Bangkok based, no issues sorting. It does sound a bit weird, and no other country does it, but if stuck using a Thai medical centre others have still reported as difficult. They just won't take the responsibility, become very fearful - and I have experienced that myself one time. Now, for the Life Certificate I either go in to a British doctor or a medical centre well-used to farangs. For the medical certificate for driving licence I go into the very Thai medical centre next door.

Michael *******

It’s an issue related to the change in payment process, pension used to be collected from the post office every week, always remember my Nan doing it, with auto payments now they have to avoid all the scammers out there which I fully support I wonder what age this kicks in, bit of a pain for us living offshore……

Mark *********

ORIGINAL POSTER

But LIfe Certification only applies to state pensioners outside UK. At face value that seems very odd to me. There must be greater problems within UK through direct payment if only as a function of sheer volume. Expats are a tiny number of people. In fact it is because we are so numerically inconsequential (and spread across the globe) that our frozen pensions are never argued against. We are a miniscule lobby.

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Mark *********

Ken *******

I received a message too saying the same..I usually phone them to check after about 6 weeks.

Mark *********

ORIGINAL POSTER

@Ken ******

Thank you Ken. I am sure it was the pressure from you and others who secured this change, an important change.