What can I do if my extension based on marriage in Thailand was denied after a work permit cancellation?

Feb 18, 2024
9 months ago
Bart **************
ORIGINAL POSTER
Okay let's discuss this. Earlier this week I failed to obtain my extension based on Thai marriage, and I'd like to know other's experiences to understand what went wrong.

Employment until January 29. Work permit and extension based on employment cancelled on January 29 by the company agent. Passport returned on January 30. Immigrations Chamchuri Square gave me a 21 day stamp 'to leave the country'. My work, the agent, and even officers are Chamchuri Square, all confirmed to me that this 21 day stamp CAN be changed to an extension based on marriage with Thai spouse. Had both read and heard that Cheangwatthana would require 21 days for this thing, but heard that they would give an "under consideration" stamp, from a usually exceptionally reliable source on Thai visa matters.

Made appointment with Cheangwatthana for the said extension, earliest opportunity at a convenient time (going with a minor) was Monday 12 February. Extension failed. Not only was the list of documents given by my employer hopelessly incomplete (that was a calculated risk; didn't go on the last day for this exact reason); no the real problem here was that they outright denied that the 21 day BOI status Chamchuri Square stamp did not qualify for switching. Went higher up a few times and in the end had four different officers all tell me the same thing: that stamp can NOT be switched.

The same exceptionally reliable source I referred to above told me that it was the weirdest thing he ever heard in all his dealings with Thai immigrations in his entire life (and he probably dealt more with them than anyone else who has ever lived). He said that probably a handful of the people sitting around me at that exact time would have the exact same stamp in their passport as I had, and would get the said extension without issue. Other sources who are usually similarly reliable have however told me the opposite, so fair to say, I'm confused.

In the end my company intervened and negotiated a 60 day extension based on visiting Thai family.

Maybe last thing to add: immigrations officers said also that switching to spouse extension from anything that wasn't non-immigrant type O was not possible. So as if we're back to the days without switching reason to stay, when we could only change reasons by going abroad. This somewhat improbable claim makes me still doubt whether their call to deny me the extension because that particular stamp wasn't good for switching was at all right.

So I do not really know what my rights were at the time. Do they normally switch that 21 days stamp from Chamchuri Square to other extension types? Or not? Was the mistake to cancel the WP and work-based extension on the last day? Would they change extensions then? Does it require having 15 days remaining (the 21 days that I saw on the immigrations website turned out to be 15 instead so could have gone in the first days of my 21 days Chamchuri stamp in retrospect). Have they stopped doing extensions for spouse with anything other than non-O perhaps since this year?

Any experiences/insights are welcome.
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TLDR : Answer Summary
The user experienced difficulties transitioning from a work-based visa to a marriage-based extension in Thailand. After a work permit was canceled, they received a 21-day stamp from Chamchuri Square, which they believed could be converted into a marriage extension. However, upon visiting Cheangwatthana, multiple officers denied that this was possible, leading to confusion about the regulations. The user expressed uncertainty about their rights and the options available, while others contributed their insights, suggesting border runs and alternative visa strategies, emphasizing the complexity and varied experiences regarding Thai immigration.
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Ray **********
One thing you need to learn if you plan on staying in Thailand long term you need to understand above all saving face for a Thai is most important even if you were correct the first time you were at immigration you will not convince them. Make life easy go to a neighboring contra get a 90 day non o based on marriage then get all of your paper work together and with 30 days left on your visa apply for one year extension of stay. I have been in Thailand for 19 years and found out understanding the face saving rule saves a lot of headaches.
Bob **********
I’ve never heard of a 21 day extension your best bet is to bounce out and back and apply for you extension have everything money in the bank all paperwork you’ll also be visited by an IO to confirm your address (in most cases) good luck
Dennis *********
This is one confusing post. No expert but i was always under the impression if you're working you need to be sponsored by employer and issued a work permit and get this type of visa.

You said employer canceled your work permit and then issues ensued regarding switching to marriage based visa and was denied

Then previous employer steps in and your back to employed and work permit

You're either employed and working here or your not, however after reading your post I'd have no idea which it is.
Bart **************
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Dennis ********
we agree the my post leaves much to desire on clarity, but I don't recall having written that my employer gave me a job, work permit and corresponding extension again. I maybe should have added "former" to make it more clear.

Anyway, thanks for your contribution.
Terary **********
As a foreigner you really don't have rights.. You have some privileges, which as you are discovering, can be denied.

Pattaya immigration is my local immigration office. I find it easier to drive 3 hrs to the the Cambodia border than to deal with immigration.

I changed to a marriage visa from some other type of visa, maybe emergency covid, maybe tourist, I don't recall.

I have applied for a marriage visa online, left the country and returned on that marriage visa (I have had a couple).

You might think you are right, and in some other world you maybe right, but you will not convince Thai immigration that you are right. The border is near there is no reason to fight this, bounce and come back. I find this kind of stuff a real pain in the ass but in total, I find living in Thailand worth the occasional pain in the ass.
Bart **************
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Terary *********
I don't know if I'm right. As it now looks, my employer may have failed here. And Chamchuri was incorrect.

But appreciate your views.
Bart **************
ORIGINAL POSTER
Did anyone recently switch from work-based to spouse-based extension? As Chaengwatthana immigrations said it cannot be done. At all, is what they pretty much said.
Greg ***********
@Bart *************
just do a border bounce, enter visa-exempt and immediately apply for the "change of visa tpe" from the exempt entry to a "90-days Non-Imm-O married to a Thai wife visa". After 60 days (on Chaeng Wattana possible 45 days before expiration of the 90-days stay permit) apply for the one-year extension based on marriage. You will need to meet the financial requirements, though
Jon ******
Not sure why you werent on extension/visa based on family from the beginning.

But in any case, you are overcomplicating things. Hop to Penang or Savannakhet and obtain single/multiple entry non-o based on marriage. Then make a new extension for family based on the new non-o entry.
Bart **************
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Jon *****
well various very good reasons, first I wasn't married, second the employer handles visa matters and business is what they go for, third it is a much better visa to have in terms of the process etc. I find your suggestion strange; no one qualifying for non-B would get a non-O based on spouse.

Also disagree that I've overcomplicated things. The exact purpose outspoken by my employer first and also by me was that I should not be brought in a position where I had to leave the country. I know it's a trickier process than the 'standard' and that there are pitfalls, but I knew it could be done, and should normally be able to follow my employer's guidance on it.
Jon ******
@Bart *************
Sorry your employer put you through that. Perhaps your first intro to "face" and Thai bureaucracy.

You can still work and obtain work permits with non-o visa or non-o based extensions. And it is better for you as your permission to stay/extension of stay is not tied directly to your employer.

It's actually also LESS paperwork for your employer also. They just need to take care of the work permit. The non-b is really only feasible if you cannot easily qualify for non-o. But as they say in Thailand, "up to you."
Bart **************
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Jon *****
I now see the benefit of having a spouse-based extension over work-based extension, in the way that the pitfall my work now stepped into wouldn't have been there.

However, my company would not have allowed it. Companies can not allow employees to handle their own visa and extensions. There are other pitfalls in this whole scene. Think of the scenario their employee goes abroad without obtaining a re-entry permit. I wouldn't have done that, but many unknowing employees could easily make that mistake. It's not obvious you'd need to make arrangements before going abroad.

I'd, frankly speaking, also not have screwed this transition up, had they left it to me. I'd have managed to pull it off, probably with some help from this group. But they didn't leave it to me, they just said they'd cancel my WP and work permit on the very last day and I'd transition to spouse from that 21 days stamp. Who am I then to contest their judgement? I'm not really supposed to just take work permit matters in my own hands (extension might - but WP, no). Although I did have doubts, I trusted the company on this, especially after they spoke out so clearly that they were going to help me arrange everything and that their purpose was that I didn't have to leave my baby.
Us *****
I just read what you wrote and it's like understanding calculus for the first time. I think I am just going to pay for the Elite visa to stay in this country.
Bart **************
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Us ****
I might have made a remark or two about that in any other situation, but here, I just don't have the right to speak :p

But okay, let me say this. I have the feeling that my experience may at least be somewhat exceptional. It may not have been truly preventable considering mistakes that were made outside of my own control (it now looks like my employer dropped the ball), but I do not want to discourage you getting a more affordable visa, or at least attempting that first. I think the clubs you visit are better value for your money :p
Us *****
@Bart *************
I hope you will find a way. There is always a way. Good luck buddy.
Bart **************
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Us ****
thanks 🙏
Sk **********
Whenever you want to change your visa category or extension or long stay or marriage or employment, easiest thing for western people is to go neighbour countries and apply new visa with proper list of documentation with new category rather than staying in Thailand doing drama with all the immigration officers of Thailand.Sometimes you have to pay extra money for special services you know 😁
Bart **************
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Shahil *******
I know it's more straightforward that way, but to be fair, switching was possible (as it now looks like, had my employer cancelled the WP on time), and with a minor in house it was considered necessary by both my employer and by me that I'd not have to leave the country.
John **********
I'd say that when you cancelled your extension of stay you should have immediately applied to switch to an extension of stay based on marriage. Once you have a stamp giving you x days to leave the country (which is not an extension) you have no option but to leave the country within the time provided by that stamp
Bart **************
ORIGINAL POSTER
@John *********
you sure this also holds for the 21 days stamp for BOI companies? I know it does for the 7 days extension denied stamp, but to my understanding this is not an extension denied stamp but just some stamp giving 21 days (but indeed to leave the country).

I mean it certainly does look like the most probable scenario on what went wrong, but I did go to Chamchuri myself in order to ask them exactly this. Officers there then asked how many days I'd get from the company, 7 or 21. So I said 21. They said: well then yes, then you can switch. (Which speaks for the scenario that I should have applied with more than 15 days remaining, however then it's hard to explain why Chaengwatthana gave me another reason)
John **********
@Bart *************
if the stamp says you have to leave then you have to leave as I understand it
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