Is it cheaper to transfer money to Thailand using Wise or a bank wire transfer?

Aug 25, 2021
3 years ago
Bonnie *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
Thanks for the advise on my last question. We've got another. I've seen lots on here with people recommending Wise for the transfer of money into a Thai bank account. I've also looked at just doing a wire from my bank account. I may be missing something but it seems cheaper doing it that way. Here's my calculations:

Wise - first I assume wise takes the money from my bank by ACH so there is no cost there. Moving $25000 usd Wise will cost about $150. My Thai bank will charge 250 baht to accept the wire.

Wire from my bank - it costs $15 for the wire, my Thai bank converts it at the bank standard rate which is fairly consistent. Today's rate for such a transfer was only about 1000 baht difference, about $30. So the cost is about $45, and the Thai bank will again charge the 250 baht wire fee.

Please tell me if I am missing something. Thanks.
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TLDR : Answer Summary
The user is comparing two methods for transferring $25,000 to a Thai bank account: using Wise and a traditional bank wire transfer. They detail the costs associated with both methods, noting that Wise charges approximately $150 for the transfer while their bank wire costs around $45 plus a 250 baht fee from the Thai bank. Several commenters suggest that while bank transfers often have lower flat fees for large amounts, the hidden costs related to exchange rates can make Wise more favorable. The discussion also touches on ensuring a transfer is recognized as international for visa purposes and the importance of timing due to upcoming visa application deadlines.
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Ivan ************
What you are underestimating is the bank margin on the foreign exchange In Thailand with most banks it's a very small % on USD-THB, but that still adds up on $25,000.

Right now KrungSri is 32.42. Midmarket on Google (and Wise) is 32.64. 0.22 difference may not seem like a lot, but 0.22 * 25,000 = 5,500B or $168. That's what you are really paying the bank for the transfer, more than the other fees like the 500B and the $15 US side. Most of the cost is buried in the forex margin, so you just don't see it. With Wise, they itemise this out.
Ivan ************
@Bon***
if you look at the time the bank sets the TT rate you'll see they add their margin to it. On average, unless the rate just happens to move in your favour during the day, Wise will work out cheaper. But if you need guaranteed international into KrungSri, sure, do a wire.
Bonnie *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Ivan ***********
- I underestimated nothing with regards to those numbers. At the time of my post the KrungSri tt rate was 32.84 and the wise rate was 32.88 as I indicated. A day later the bank rate started dropping, unknown why. That's why I suddenly started getting interested in Wise because it then became a better deal. But the wise transfer is no deal if it can't be shown as an international transfer at KrungSri. Now I am told here that in order to get my non-o visa for retirement purposes from our 30 day visa exempt extension it has to be shown as an international transfer. So given that all that information was supplied, people should be told that when asking about what bank to go to, to get an account in Thailand. Specifically that wise will only show that with Bangkok bank. I don't even know where that information comes from regarding the requirement of where the money comes from.
Ivan ************
@Bon***
this can happen if the rate moves during the day, point is most of the cost of the transfer if doing it through a bank is the margin they add to the forex.
Bonnie *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Ivan ***********
- yes, that why I looked at the tt rate.
George *************
By the way, this is how people should be making the decision about whether to use SWIFT transfer or Wise. Get a spreadsheet or a piece of paper and figure out what your US bank is going to charge you, what your Thai bank is going to charge you, what fees Wise is going to charge you, what exchange rate is going to be used by your Thai bank (the TT rate), and what exchange rate is going to be used by Wise. You'd be amazed at the number of people who don't look at some of those components and make less than optimal decisions.

Wise makes it very easy for you to determine these costs, you have to figure it out for your US bank and Thai bank yourself.
Bonnie *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
It does seem the wire transfer is cheaper. My only concern is the timing. We waited a bit long to get this going. The us banks open in a few hours.

Our 30 day extension of our visa exempt entry expires on Sept 15. From what I've read here we have to apply for the non-o by Aug 31? (Or do we have until Sept 1?) The wire transfer could take 2 to 7 business days to process. Wise would likely be within two days. The wire transfer could still be complete before that deadline, then we have to get the letter from the bank and have our passbooks updated.

If we don't make that deadline, we see this as our option: get the covid extension then get the non-o. I've also read here sometimes they won't allow that. Seems to vary. I'll bet Google (some people consider that doing your own homework, ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!) doesn't cover that. Any advice?
George *************
Just as an added prod to get on with the transfer, using the covid extensions (if allowed) will end up costing your 1,900 baht/person as that is the cost of applying for a covid extension (any extension, actually). Getting the transfer done promptly avoids this extra cost.
George *************
@Bonnie ******
Better to try to make the deadline. You've analyzed the situation (which method is cheaper in this case) well and it's time to pull the trigger, in my opinion. I would make August 31 your deadline, as that leaves 15 full calendar days before your current permission to stay expires. If you initiate the transfer today I think you have an excellent chance of having the transfer complete successfully by or hopefully before August 31. Don't delay with the transfer would be my advice.

The covid extension is a possible plan B but I hope and expect it won't be needed if you proceed in a timely manner with the transfer.

Obviously, you can do almost all the paperwork for the non-O visas beforehand and only need the bank letter from the bank.

Also, unless you have specific guidance from the immigration office you plan to use, the guidance from the Phuket Immigration Volunteers is pretty comprehensive. I would take a look at that if you haven't already or have better information from your local office:

******************************************************
Bonnie *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
@George ************
- the article you provided specifies 21 days. I've been told 15 days, I hope that's right for Bangkok.
George *************
@Bonnie ******
Ahh yes, that's the danger of seeing guidelines for a different immigration office than the one you will be using. There are unfortunately differences. In this case, if you will be using Bangkok and you know they only require 15 days then that should be what you need to do. With respect to this deadline you can safely ignore the rule in Phuket as it won't apply to you.
Bonnie *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Frank ******
- the rate given to us at the bank yesterday was 32.84. For $
*****
that is
*****
0 baht. It's their TT rate. The USA bank charges $15 and the Thai bank charges 250 baht.

The wise rate given yesterday was 32.88 with the amount specified to reach the account
*****
0 baht. Fairly sure the Thai bank will still charge 250 baht for that transfer.
George *************
@Bonnie ******
The only thing I see that is wrong with the above (or contrary to my experience) is that I do not believe you will be charged 250 from the Thai bank for the transfer. The 250 fee allowed by the Bank of Thailand is to *convert* money from a foreign currency into Thai baht. That's not what Wise does. It transfers Thai baht already in Thailand into our account. I do not believe your Thai bank charges anything for the transfer of Thai baht into your Thai bank account.

The 250 baht charge will be made by your Thai bank if you transfer USD to Thailand and your Thai bank is responsible for doing the conversion into THB.

Assuming your other numbers are correct then as you say in this particular set of circumstances with your relatively low US bank wire transfer fee ($15) the relative closeness of the exchange rates for your Thai bank and that used by Wise, then it does seem that not using Wise to make the transfer would be the wiser (pun intended) choice. Don't think that's universally true but on this day with these banks and this amount it seems to be.
Bonnie *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
@George ************
- if the Thai baht is already in Thailand, does it still show as an overseas transfer? That seems to be important for the non-o visa.
George *************
@Bonnie ******
Interestingly, yes it can. The easiest way for this to happen requires that you use Bangkok Bank (because it's one of Wise's Thai partner banks) and most importantly when you indicate the reason for the transfer you have to pick the one that says "for purpose of long term stay in Thailand." If you do it that way the transfer gets marked FTT in your Bangkok Bank account passbook (meaning a Foreign Telegraphic Transfer) which is one of the codes immigration looks for to be satisfied that the transfer came from overseas. As far as I know, this works for none of the other Wise Thai partner banks which will show the transfer as domestic.

In reality, the transfer (at least the last part of it) is domestic as Wise transfers from one of their Thai bank accounts into your Thai bank account. However, conceptually the overall transfer is international because you are having your money sent from the US and it ends up in your account in Thailand (which is what happens actually in a SWIFT wire transfer). So it's a legitimate international transfer and if you use Bangkok Bank as your Thai bank and use the "long term stay in Thailand" reason it will turn out in such a way as to satisfy immigration.
Bonnie *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
@George ************
- you may be right on that one, if done through wise.
George *************
@Bonnie ******
I think I'm right about the Thai bank not charging a "conversion" fee when receiving money from a Wise transfer for a couple reasons.: one as explained above the final transfer to your Thai bank happens from one of Wise's Thai bank accounts so it's not really a conversion just a straight deposit from one Thai bank account to another all in Thai baht. No conversion takes place.

The other reason is that Wise gives you an indication that XXX.XXX baht will be deposited to your Thai bank account if you go ahead with this transfer. And my recollection is that number is exactly correct, that is to say, it's not missing 250 baht, it's right on the money. Wise is good about accounting for any fees and charges so the fact that it doesn't mention this charge indicates to me that it doesn't impose this fee (or pass it on to you. Probably because as explained above it's a conversion fee and they are only really doing a deposit rather than a conversion).
John ********
What country
Bonnie *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
Charles ********
Note for US customers: If you transfer more than 9999.00 it throws up a BIG RED FLAG to the IRS.
Bonnie *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Charles *******
- it's our money, I don't care about red flags. I thought that was only for cash anyway.
George *************
@Bonnie ******
yeah, I would have no worry about doing this kind of transfer. To be honest the US government can look at anything they want to and given an interest on their part they absolutely do. You will likely be reporting the $10,000 baht equivalent balance in your Thai account as part of your 2021 year FATCA FBAR report due next year. The US government sees a lot of stuff because they are extremely nosy. I think red flags is the wrong way to look at it. If you're not laundering money and I doubt you are you have very little to worry about beyond what every American citizen needs to worry about already. ;-)
Charles ********
@Geo***
: By Red Flag, I meant it will get reported to the IRS whether you like it or not. So a person doing this kind of transfer needs to make sure they report the Thai bank account and the money on their taxes. A friend of mine who worked for the IRS told me that there is a 100% penalty for not reporting offshore bank accounts with more than $10,000 in them. For the last few years when you open a new account in Thailand, you have to sign a form allowing the Bank to report it to the IRS.
George *************
@Charles *******
the penalty is not 100%, but only 50%. I recommend filing the FBAR as required
Bonnie *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Charles *******
- I don't care about red flags. I have no problem reporting my foreign account. I will not own any additional tax.
Frank *******
I think you are drastically underestimating the difference in the exchange rate you will receive. I think it will be close to .50 of 1 point. 12,500 baht difference vs 1,000 baht difference. If you are correct that the difference is only 1,000 thai baht then you shouldn't even consider Wise.
Elisa *******
When I transfer to wise USD to USD account then they send me Thai baht from a Thai baht account. Exchange guaranteed. On $2000 it cost $10 to transfer to them and they charged me $16. No charge on Thai end and guaranteed exchange rate amount from Wise was good
Sharon *******
Same wirh uk banks, wise wins to transfer smaller amounts but uk banks charge a flat fee so they win for large amounts
Marcus *********
What about the other way? large vs small banks vs wire or <insert some other exchange>?
Jon ********
@Sharon ******
however UK banks offer lower exchange rates compared to wise thats my experience
Kool *******
If you are getting SWIFT transfer fees of just $15 for international transfers from your bank for that amount then that is the way to go, but, there is another element you should set up before you do this. Bangkok Bank has what's called a Foreign Currency Deposit account. By having this type of account you can transfer dollars into the account, and they stay as dollars until you decide to convert them into baht, and at the bank TT rate, which is the best rate. The fee to do this by the bank is a minimum of bt200, and a max fee of bt500 no matter how much you transfer. It takes a minimum of US$1000 to set the account up, and there is no fee on the account as long as the balance stays above $250. If there is an immigration concern, for whatever reason, immigration recognizes these accounts, but estimates the value in baht at that days rate. Set up an FCD account as the baht seems to fluctuate, being slightly stronger in the middle of the month than at the beginning when most get their moneys sent.
Ivan ************
@Kool ******
Wise is now better than the Bangkok Bank TT rate for USD. Any amount.
Joseph ******
@Kool ******
agreed with this route but caveat: the FcD account is not insured by Bangkok bank , so be vigilant…
Chris ****
From my chase it’s a flat $5
Frank-Steven ***********
@Samurais ***********
And what about the exchange rate? Big spread then, I would assume.
Chris ****
Neil **********
Get into crypto currency’s
Bonnie *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Neil *********
- let's hope that never takes off.
Neil **********
@Bonnie ******
I think you will find it’s too late to stop it now !
Paul *******
I use wise all the time the thai bank has never charged me for transfer
Hans *********
My Retirement go now 4 Years to Wise and from there to me or wherever I want never A Problem.

The work all time to be better.

Between without weekend, the need 10 to 20 Second and the Money its from Germany on Krungthai Bank.

The have a higher exchangrate and the Fee is only about 14,28€ of 2.500€ you arive today (25.08) 96.032Baht. Exchangre is 38,63
Niclas ***********
I think depending on country Wise have different fees / costs.

SGD to THB yesterday with less than 1000 USD gave me following cost in percentage.

1.0073511044 so roughly 0.75% rounded up heavily. I calculate with Google available rate on THB on the SGD amount. So the delta including fees and exchange rate given.
**********
*****
*****
so roughly 0.75% rounded up heavily. I calculate with Google available rate on THB on the SGD amount. So the delta including fees and exchange rate given.

You need to transfer quite a big amount to beat this with flat rates. Honestly most banks also take a huge cut on exchange rate so I haven't personally found better whenever I check to compare. If I missed some bank or service let me know. :)

Wise doesn't take any fee locally or in the destination for the transfer since they do local transfers. Meaning you send locally and receive locally from their account.
Thomas *********
Myself I love Wise. The costs are minimal but what I like most is the speed. Last month I transferred my money from my Caymans account to my Wise at 9am. It reach my Wise account by 9:12. I then converted the money to THB. I than sent it to my SCB at 9:17 and it arrived confirmed by the SCB app by 9:24. I one very happy Wise customer.
Frank-Steven ***********
In international money transfer (SWIFT) there are three options about who is paying fees: OUR, BEN and SHARE. OUR means the sender pays all the fees involved. BEN means the recipient pays all transfer fees involved. And SHARE, well, here fees are shared and most fees are covered by the sender, yet some also by the recipient. With Wise, what you see is what you get, i.e. they clearly state the amount you pay and the exact amount the recipient receives - thus applying the aforementioned OUR option. With most normal banks (or the also popular Revolut for example), they use SHARE (which is the more common standard, as it is easier for the banks). Now, may I ask which Thai bank you have your account with? I assume Bangkok Bank, right? At least when I did a test transfer from Revolut once, they deducted 250 THB from the amount I wired. Ever since I used Wise, cause I just wanted to transparently know upfront exactly what I pay from my EU account, what amount I receive on my Thai account and what the exchange rate will be. With regular bank accounts, this is very in-transparent at times. Yes, the going rate seems to be 1.5‰ - but the unknown is the exchange rate (which can be quite disadvantageous compared to Wise) and the fees of the receiving bank - as SHARE is used. But if your numbers are correct, and you only pay a flat fee of USD 15 and only have an exchange rate disadvantage amounting to THB 1,000 and a small receiving fee of just 250 THB.... By all means, cheaper than Wise, then for this rather large transfer.
Bonnie *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Frank-Steven **********
- and where does the options you show for swift get chosen, and by whom?
Frank-Steven ***********
@Bonnie ******
These are all good questions. And the answer to that varies from bank to bank. And this is the main reason why I use Wise: Fair conditions and - even more importantly - transparent about what exactly all fees and exchange rates involved are. What you see with Wise is exactly what you send and exactly what you / or someone else receive. No surprises - no hidden fees. So until I will some day need to transfer an amount in excess of a couple of thousands, I won’t bother doing it the old school, intransparent bank way.
Bonnie *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Frank-Steven **********
- how does wise take the money out, by ACH? To me that means no cost for that part.
Bonnie *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
I don't believe that wise can do anything about the receiving banks fees.
Andy ********
@Bonnie ******
I have a Krung Sri account and I have never been charged a fee for receiving money from Wise. The money stated is always what I receive in my account.
Bonnie *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Frank-Steven **********
- our accounts are with Krungrsri.
Justin *****************
F
Ray *********
I got a much better rate going through wise than I would have with bangkok bank.
Jonas *************
For smaller amount I take it
Peter ********
maybe wait 6 mos.? exchange rate for dollar is predicted to skyrocket!!!! could save you alot of money????
Bonnie *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Peter *******
- we are in Thailand now working on our non-o visa.
Frank-Steven ***********
Bangkok Bank never charged me anything for „accepting a wire“ from Wise. But the 250 THB you mentioned are negligible anyway. But it does feel like you are missing something. Are you certain your bank would only charge a flat fee of USD 15 for that transfer? No additional percentage of the amount wired. Not an expert on wiring from the US. But something seems odd, since the whole USP of Wise is to allow for cheaper transfers. Following.
Bonnie *******
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Frank-Steven **********
- totally sure the only fee from my bank is $15. I think someone else on here may be correct that the 250 baht charge is for the conversion, so that wouldn't apply to wise.
Brandon ************
@Frank-Steven **********
with smaller transfers, wise is superior because it's just a small % plus a tiny base fee.

With a wire transfer you get a flat fee from the sending bank and receiving bank, and a conversation margin from one of the banks. With larger amounts of money the flat fees can come out better than Wise. But you'd have to get pretty large sums to reach the crossover point.
Frank-Steven ***********
@Brandon ***********
True. I guess with sending larger amounts (beyond a few thousand) it comes down to the applied exchange rate.
Brandon ************
I've never had my bank charge me a fee for accepting a transfer from Wise though.
Brandon ************
With larger amounts of money, it can indeed benefit you by doing a wire transfer since it's more of a flat fee, except for the margin the bank takes for the conversion (make sure you let the Thai bank do the conversion and not let your home bank convert to baht before sending. They'll really screw you). Wise is more of a tiny base fee and then a %, so the more you transfer, the higher your fee. It can be pretty difficult to compare sometimes though.
Frank ******
@Brandon ***********
agree, WISE .7% fee all depends on Thai bank exchange, Bangkok Bank have lousy exchange so wise better for me
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