Answered2 years ago
Can I use non-taxable passive income to qualify for the LTR Visa Wealthy Pensioner category in Thailand?
Can I apply for the LTR Visa under the Wealthy Pensioner category using non-taxable passive income to meet the $80k requirement? I earned significant passive income (dividends, capital gains) in tax-deferred IRAs and reinvested it in those same accounts as tax-deferred transactions. The income appears on my brokerage statements but not on my tax returns because the income is not taxable yet. Will the BOI credit this passive income toward the $80k requirement?
There have been similar posts here in the past but the answers were not definitive, stating "ask the BOI" or "apply and find out". I would like to know if anyone has had their LTR visa approved using this approach.
There have been similar posts here in the past but the answers were not definitive, stating "ask the BOI" or "apply and find out". I would like to know if anyone has had their LTR visa approved using this approach.
Answer summary
The inquiry revolves around whether non-taxable passive income from tax-deferred IRAs can be credited toward the $80,000 requirement for the LTR Visa's Wealthy Pensioner category. Users in the comments generally suggest that since the income is not realized until withdrawals are made from the IRAs, it may not be considered actual income by the BOI. Many recommend contacting the BOI for specific advice, as interpretations can vary based on individual circumstances. There are alternative suggestions for managing visa status that don't involve the LTR Visa.
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Steve ****
It’s “ask BOI” because authorities can be arbitrary. On the face of it, income is income. Your tax return is one way of showing incoming but so are brokerage statements. So they likely would accept those but again - it’s up to them.
Ravit ******************
As far as I read today, the 80k usd will be removed from the criteria of this visa:
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3&language=enColin *******
@Ravit *****************
not for the wealthy pensioner option 🤣🤣Ravit ******************
@Colin ******
oh, I thought he referred to the Global Wealthy visa. Sorry for my mistake.Nongnuch ********
why would you overcomplicte matters? Just deposit a minimum of 800,000 THB in your Thai bank account, enter Thailand on a "90-days Non-Imm-O retirement/over 50 visa" and apply for the 1-year extension of stay permit based on retirement. It's less rocket science than the LTR
Todd *********
@Nongnuch *******
LTR - show screenshots of your monthly income for 12 months. And you get the visa. Nothing easier in Thai immigration history. And it’s 10 year. No losing money on 800k in the bank. No annual grovelling at immigration and your bank for extension. No 90 day reporting. Multiple entry. And TAX FREE. It’s by FAR the best visa ever offered in Thailand and an absolute no brainer if you qualify
Nongnuch ********
@Todd ********
if it's a no brainer, then please advice @Tim **********
on how easy it is to get an LTR issued 😂😂😂Todd *********
@Nongnuch *******
i have. It's that easy. One would be utterly daft to seek a ludicrous O/O-A if they qualify for LTR. He just needs to understand what qualifies as income. And what doesn't. Not exactly rocket science
John **********
@Nongnuch *******
except the LTR Wealthy Pensioner gives you an exemption on tax on overseas income remitted to ThailandColin *******
@John *********
and that is significant for some folks.
Charles ********
@Nongnuch *******
doesn't that visa also require insurance?Nongnuch ********
@Charles *******
no, it does not come with a mandatory insurance. That would be the 365-days Non-Imm-O/A Longstay visa that requires a police check, mandatory health check and mandatory health insurance. None of these requirements are needed for the Non-Imm-O retirement/over 50 visaJohn **********
They won't accept that. It's not income until you realise it as income. You would need to withdraw the money from the IRAs in order to show it as passive income.
Todd *********
I think you will encounter some difficulties with this path. Especially as it is retained in your IRA. You have to show actual income, not investment returns
Tim ***********
OP@Todd ********
It is income, just not taxable as it is reinvested in a tax-free account. It is not unrealized capital gains.Todd *********
@Tim **********
no - its not. And it will be taxable once it actually is income. We all have retained income inside retirement accounts. Meanwhile, it’s not passive income for BOI, until it’s actually income. That’s how the BOI is gonna see it. But give it a go. It’s their decision
But once you take it out and have a taxable event, it will absolutely count as passive income.
Todd *********
@Tim **********
i totally understand this. Almost anyone who qualifies for LTR retiree has same or similar. The problem is that they are re-invested in same account. And when you remove the funds from your account, they will count it as income. That’s all you need to do.
Tim ***********
OP@Todd ********
It is dividends, interest, and realized capital gains that would appear on a 1099 if not for the fact that they were paid from (and reinvested into) a retirement account. It is not unrealized capital gain from share price increase, nor current year contributions from earned income. But whether or not this constitutes "passive income" is the gist of the question.
David ***********
@Todd ********
Investment income is actual, passive income. The wealthy pensioner visa doesn’t accept employment income for obvious reasons.David ***********
@Todd ********
Oh yeah, it’s in his IRA. It’s non-accessible so they likely won’t accept it.Todd *********
@Colin ******
I think this is solid adviceColin *******
@Tim **********
same as Aussie Super and most other savings plans worldwide. Until you transfer the funds to a bank account in your name, it is not your income. You are the beneficial owner, but not income in your name from a legal POV. Even when you transfer funds be careful about how you perform this. In my experience the BOI do not like once a year transfers. In their world people need regular monthly / quarterly income steam.Todd *********
@Bob *********
likely so. They just want to see 80k annual passive income
Bob **********
@David **********
so my investments are not in an IRA would they work ??Todd *********
@Tim **********
it’s entirely locked up, until you unlock and man up to using it for what you saved it for. Essentially they are saying that you need to ‘choose to access it now’ or they won’t recognize it. Because it’s NOT income until it’s income. You can’t have the proverbial cake and eat it too. They want evidence that you have the income to qualify. And it has to be consistent incomeTim ***********
OP@David **********
It is not really "locked" at all. I am over 60 so it is accessible to me any time that I choose to withdraw it. I have not needed to withdraw it as I still work and continue to have earned income, but my intention is to retire and move to Thailand and live off these investments. So I'm not really a pensioner yet, and I won't have Social Security for another 1.5 years. But my portfolio is already providing $80+k/yr in dividends, interest, and realized capital gains (not including unrealized capital appreciation from share price increases).Todd *********
@David **********
it isn’t income this case. It’s locked in a retirement account. And gives you $0 income until you take it out
Brandon ************
The reason you see other answers of "ask the BOI" is because that's the correct answer. No one has the same financial circumstances as you, and even if they did, that doesn't mean the BOI will will evaluate them the same, as they are humans. The BOI makes all of the decisions on qualification and approvals, so you need to ask the BOI. They are very responsive to questions and will usually reply the same day or by the next day.
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