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How do taxes on a US pension work for expats on an OA retirement visa in Thailand?
OA Retirement VisaUS PensionThailand TaxationTax ResidencyIncome TaxForeign IncomeTax TreatyExpat TaxThai Revenue Department
Jul 28, 2024
2 years ago
Bigd **********
ORIGINAL POSTERI know this is not a tax profession site, but if on an OA retirement visa, how do taxes on my US pension work? Tips? Experience? TIA
TLDR : Answer Summary
For expats in Thailand on an OA retirement visa, the taxation of US pensions is influenced by several factors including tax residency status and any applicable tax treaties between the US and Thailand. Generally, pensions are not taxed if they are considered foreign-sourced income and if the individual is not recognized as a tax resident (staying less than 180 days in Thailand). However, those who become tax residents must declare income brought into Thailand, but may be exempt from taxes on income earned before January 1, 2024, pending documentation of its source. It's recommended to seek professional tax advice to navigate these complex regulations.
NON-O RETIREMENT VISA RESOURCES / SERVICES
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Peter **********
We have a new Facebook group about the tax rules for expats. Make sure you do proper planning long before moving to Thailand!
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/Greg ********
Govt should say only those who make over $500k US per year must report. Everyone else no hassle and no reporting. Otherwise this is a huge hassle for most people and simply a make work project for the accounting industry.
If they need retirees to contribute to tax base just make it a flat fee of 300 us per year and no hassle and no witch hunt.
If they need retirees to contribute to tax base just make it a flat fee of 300 us per year and no hassle and no witch hunt.
Jeff ********
It depends a lot on whether you're dating the girl in your picture or if you're just "haning out."
Jim ******
Check out a professional website for accurate information. I recommend
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Andy ************
@Jim *****
No thanks! I'll get my advice from the Thai Tax Office for free!Reply to
Andy ************
Reply
David ********
And this is why you shouldn’t ask such questions on Facebook. Better off watching YouTube videos! 😂🤣
Tim *********
So much guesswork, and much of it said with great conviction! The Thai Revenue site has some good information for foreigners. If you stay 180+ days in a year (even in more than one visit) you are a resident for tax purposes and must submit a tax return. You must declare all money brought into Thailand, for assessment of tax liability. Your Thai tax liability is mitigated by a sliding scale of allowances. You can also deduct tax paid in the country the money originated from, subject to the specific details of the DTA between Thailand and that country.
All this is already in Thai law, and every resident will need to submit a tax return on their 2024 income imports. The Thai government is still considering a recommendation from the Revenue that all worldwide income should be assessable for tax, but this is not currently the law
All this is already in Thai law, and every resident will need to submit a tax return on their 2024 income imports. The Thai government is still considering a recommendation from the Revenue that all worldwide income should be assessable for tax, but this is not currently the law
Tony ********
@Tim ********
the only other stipulation is if accessable income is greater than 120k baht, if your income because of DTA detail or can be proven to be excludable (wholly earnt prior to 2024), so not assessable, their is no need to file a tax return. Wouldn't exclude you from tax audit, or tax owed payment if they don't agree with your proof.Tim *********
@Tony *******
Yes that's also my understanding, Tony. Since they didn't apply this law fully in 2023 or earlier, they will not assess tax on money you bring in from now on that was originally earned prior to 1 January 2024Reply to
Tim *********
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Nippanut ***************
classified as foreign sourced income --> Not taxable if brought into Thailand IF you earned it in the year you are not tax resident of Thailand
This is under the domestic laws.
This is under the domestic laws.
Rob *********
@Nippanut **************
that has changed.Tony ********
@Nippanut **************
this statement is no longer valid. The rule change moved the goalposts, its now only tax exempt if earned before *****
/2023 on remitted funds.Reply to
Tony ********
Reply
Braulio *********
For accurate information, consult a competent CPA.
Phil ******
@Bigd *********
depends on your tax residency whether taxed in US or Thailand you'll pay tax. Really get professional advice.Frank-Steven ***********
All income brought into Thailand generally will be subject to income tax in Thailand, if you become a tax resident by staying in Thailand for more than 180 days per calendar / tax year. Having said that, that does not automatically lead to you having to pay taxes on your pension. A tax treaty between the two countries might prevent that by making sure you don’t have to pay (full) tax on incomes that was already taxed, twice. If that applied for US-Thailand I cannot say.
Andy ************
Pensioners are not taxed in Thailand.
Bob **********
All this started over law that said if you earned money abroad and kept it out of Thailand for one year you can bring it in tax free now that’s over but a pensioner I doubt it
Paul ********
I also had a work permit here for 1 year and did not have to pay any tax at home Fact.
John **********
@Andy ***********
that is a sweeping statement which will be true for some and not true for others. Everyone needs to consult the DTA between their country (if one exists) and Thailand. Some are much more generous than others. Nevertheless all income brought into Thailand is assessable for Thai tax including all pension income then you use the relevant DTA to claim an exemption in your thai tax return, should the DTA provide for suchAndy ************
@John *********
Correct. It's very easy for Australians to be dual tax residents of both Thailand and Australia. The steps are followed in the DTA to determine which country is the predominant one.Reply to
Andy ************
Reply
Colin *******
@Andy ***********
this is incorrect. Please check with a CPA. Andy as you are from Sydney you would know that Aussie age pension is assessable income in Australia and also in Thailand. Your income MAY be below the personal allowance for tax, and it may not especially if you have rental income for instance. To say, as a blanket statement, pensions are not taxed in Thailand is frankly just plain incorrect.Andy ************
@Colin ******
Not quite. If the recipient retains Australian Tax Residency, pensions are not taxable in ThailandColin *******
@Andy ***********
you are assuming less than 180 days in any calendar year in Thailand. If so, your original statement is rather academic. If you are over 180 days in Thailand then you become tax resident in both countries and the DTA states how various items are taxed. The age pension, as opposed to a work for the government type pension is taxable income in Thailand if the funds are remitted.Andy ************
@Colin ******
Not for Australians. The DTA contains a test process which determines which residency takes precedence when a dual residency exists. When this is done, pensions are dealt with under the laws of the respective countryColin *******
@Andy ***********
Ah, so now you rely on the finer points of a tie breaker in the DTA. Thus your original statement is just plain wrong. You really should edit it to state the specific circumstances where it is tax free in Thailand. The blanket statement , I think you agree, is misleading.Andy ************
@Colin ******
I'm satisfied with my opening statement. People can easily look into their own situations as they feel fit. I can't help everyone.Colin *******
@Andy ***********
all good. Now we all know that you are more than comfortable in making false statements and misleading folks with the proviso that it is buyer beware and no-one should take any notice of what you post without doing some serious research. All good, mate.Andy ************
@Colin ******
Yep. I can't help the helpless. And realistically, you're the expert when it comes to making misleading comments !Reply to
Andy ************
Reply
Pete *******
@Andy ***********
simply not true, everyone, once tax resident, is subject to Thai tax law. If pensioners remit assessable income into Thailand it will be taxed. This is not new, it has always been the case.Paul ********
@Pete ******
he is based in Nottingham England and has been in touch with the English tax office on this. 🤣Colin *******
@Paul *******
Paul in a way he may be correct and just giving you the noddy answer based on a need to know and easy to explain. How could he be right - well if he has actually analysed your total income from a Thai perspective assuming you are bringing the funds into the country, then maybe the UK tax load is higher than Thailand. Is so, the UK tax can be offset against the Thai tax and there could be zero Thai tax to pay. If the Thai tax was higher then you would have to pay the difference to Thai revenue. That's how nearly all DTA's work.Pete *******
@Paul *******
sack him and hire a competent international tax advisor.Reply to
Pete *******
Reply
Bob **********
@Pete ******
and how much do you pay?as of now my 15 years in Thailand and never had to even file in Thailand,nobody knows much yet as nobody has been taxed , several countries have tax treaty’s you should stop believing what you read and wait ,they have not enough personal to collect money owed from Thais let alone worrying about taxing pensionsAndy ************
@Pete ******
Depends on DTA and tax residency status. But generally pensions are not taxable and never have beenRob *********
@Andy ***********
some government pensions are not taxed. I believe private pensions are.Andy ************
@Rob ********
I guess it depends on the DTA. I do know Australian pensions cannot be taxed in Thailand if the recipient retains Australian tax residency (which is easy to do).Pete *******
@Andy ***********
I’m from the UK, under the DTA my private pension, my company pension and my state pension are all classed as assessable income and subject to Thai taxation once I remit into the Kingdom, the only exception is my UK civil service pension which is exempt. Saying generally pensions are not taxed is not true for Brits.Andy ************
@Pete ******
Yes I understand the UK has a very poor DTA. I can only speak for AustraliansPaul ********
@Pete ******
the uk has a duel tax treaty. Therefore you will not pay tax on money already taxed in the UKPete *******
@Paul *******
that’s plainly inaccurate. You may have to pay additional Thai tax on money remitted that has already been taxed in your home country. There is a whole system of tax credits that deals with this. It all depends on personal circumstances but it’s clear that the blanket statement if it’s taxed at home it won’t be taxed here is not correct for Brits.Paul ********
@Pete ******
I asked my account in England and that’s a factBob **********
@Paul *******
Bad accountantColin *******
@Paul *******
then your accountant is really not up to speed. Suggest you get one that actually understands international tax rules. Would you care to name your accountant so others may be informed?Reply to
Colin *******
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