What does the TransferWise option for complying with Thailand immigration requirements actually mean?

Aug 2, 2019
5 years ago
Joe ***********
ORIGINAL POSTER
Please let this stay up for a few hours. I believe it is important to TransferWise users.

I use TransferWise Borderless and have for been for about six months. In my BB Account I have been seeing FTT except for the last which said SMART. I don't know what SMART stands for, except I am pretty sure it is a Domestic Transfer.

The real point of my comment is that I use the Android TransferWise App. I was recently helping a friend transfer his funds using this same App on his phone (as he is a bit of a technophobe).

Anyway when we got near the end of the SEND transfer sequence there is a requirement that one choose one of the 6 to 8 options...

1St. One is "For Monthly Living Expenses...

The last option choice is (paraphrasing) "To help document funds transfer compliance with Thailand Immigration for long term stay"...

I can't simulate this and get the exact wording as it requires the actual completion of the funds transfer to Thailand.

Has anyone else seen this option? Does anyone know if the option is chosen for the funds transfer... what happens on the other end here in Thailand at bank?
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TLDR : Answer Summary
The post discusses a recent option added by TransferWise for funds being sent to Thailand, which states it is to help document funds transfer compliance with Thai immigration for long-term stays. The author has been using TransferWise for transfers but has noticed changes in how transfers are labeled once received in Thailand banks. Key points raised include the issue of whether selecting this option ensures funds are classified as international transfers, as this affects compliance with Thai immigration's financial requirements for expats. There are various responses from users sharing their experiences about transfer labels, bank partnerships, and the associated documentation needed to satisfy immigration regulations.
Joe ***********
ORIGINAL POSTER
This thread is closed pending a new post with new ideas. And taking the TransferWise issue to another Discussion Group
Joe ***********
ORIGINAL POSTER
I will be posting later to those interested in pursuing this problem outside of Thai Visa Advice and outside of Thai visa dot com.
Joe ***********
ORIGINAL POSTER
It is obvious that this TransferWise support person believes that the question is centered around an Investment Visa via a Condo. Interesting but has little to do with the overall need and question. But this answer from TW is all we are likely to get.

It is revealing that the banks involved have been reduced from 3 to 2... Kasikorn and Bangkok Bank. That is helpful.
Joe ***********
ORIGINAL POSTER
Ron your input is helpful but a bit myopic. You seem to think that the problem can only be solved one way. Take note of my new post coming up.

This thread is now closed so we can focus on new ideas in my forthcoming post.
Ron *******
@Joe **********
the issue is, foreign transfers being used for anything in Thailand need to be proved by using the exact same process. There is no seperate process when proving foreign income for immigration or the land office.

Anyway, good luck because that is the only answer coming from Transferwise.
Ron *******
Ok I have the answer to my question back. Nothing seems to of changed from there previous answers. Good luck attempting to sort it out!

Diane Ogechi Tobias (TransferWise)

Aug 4, 22:35 CEST

Hello Ronald,

Thank you for contacting us.

Transfers to THB would still be sent locally but we are able to route your transfer using certain banks that could provide you with a document proving that the transfer was a foreign exchange transfer.

These banks are:

Bangkok Bank.

Kasikorn Bank.

The way through this would be for you to always give us a call once you have made a transfer for the funds to be sent through any of these bank alternately, we could enable that your transfers are routed through any of the bank of your choice as much as we are able to do so.

Should the funds be sent through Bangkok bank and you have an account with Bangkok, you would need to reach out to Bangkok Bank branch where you have an account and provide the following documents:

1) Bangkok Bank Savings Passbook or Statement showing the specific transaction

2) Passport of Recipient

3) Agreement of the purchase of Condominium (for purchasing accommodation purposes)

If you do not have an account with Bangkok, you would need to provide the following to Bangkok Bank's HEAD office

Credit receipt of recipient bank transaction of the specific bank transaction

2. Passport of Recipient

3. Agreement of the purchase of Condominium (for purchasing accommodation purposes)

Once you have done so, Bangkok bank will provide you with a Confirmation Letter of International Funds Transfer and there would be a fee of 100 THB payable to Bangkok Bank .

Should the payment be sent through Kasikorn Bank to a Kasikorn bank account , you would need to provide the following documents to nearest Kbank International Trade center where you have an account and provide the following documents:

1) Recipient Bank Savings Passbook or Statement showing the specific transaction

2) Passport of Recipient

3) Visa of Recipient

These are the only 2 partners that are able to provide this document to prove that the transfer is a FET transfer. And we would be willing to cooperate with you in the best of our ability to ensure that your transfers are sent using a particular partner.

Should you have any question, feel free to contact us.

Regards,

Diane T
Ron *******
I'm still waiting for Transferwise to mail me back answering the question.....nothing forthcoming so far 🙄
Robert *******
As i don't use this, but seeing many people do and each time it is because it is cheaper, how much cheaper is it to send 65.000 Thb from your home country using transferwise into a Thai bank account?
Robert *******
Thank, my pension provider deposit with SWIFT method directly into my Thai Kasikorn bank. Last deposit little over 900 Euro = little over $ 1000 =
*****
Thb. From payment slip to actual money in the bank i lost with current exchange 17 Euro = $ 18 Dollar. But I understand the problems you have with the US Government and that is the reason i always closed these topics. Thai visa has nothing to do with banking policy in the us. Thanks.
Peter *********
@Robert ******
This is an example comparison. This transfer was over 30% less than the ACH transfer. But sometimes Transferwise is more expensive, for example, a recent $1000 transfer was $17.05, but the difference in exchange rate still makes it a better value.
John ********
@Robert ******
I reckon I get a baht more than at an exchange booth, probably
***
baht more than the standard rate at the bank the fee to send is cheaper and the use of an app makes the whole process simpler. If I send 65,000 from my bank in £, using TransferWise today rather than bank to bank I would save ฿7000 not accounting for the difference in transfer fee. X 12 = ฿94,000
Peter *********
@Robert ******
I'll calculate that for you with an example, by tomorrow.
Robert *******
Thanks for this explanation, really appreciate it. Sorry to read that after first no more income affidavits, the Us government is blocking money leaving the US. Now I only have to find out what about 25% less is. I'm not looking for an exact figure, just an about 1000 Thb or 5000 Thb will do. I just would like to see if taking the risk of a Extension of Stay refusal, paying for a trip to neighbor country, buying Tourist Visa, coming back, apply for new visa, is actually wort all the hasse of sending money cheaper.
Peter *********
Robert Lagas For me, it now is the only means. None of my sources comply with the IACH imposed by the US, so ACH transfers to Bangkok Bank NY are no longer available. My US bank requires my physical presence to make a SWIFT (wire) transfer. That said, TransferWise is faster and about 25% less expensive than ACH via BKK NY.
Richard *******
I'm in the same boat as many here. I use Transferwize because it seems to be the least expensive and quickest way to get my money. And I'm using the 65k baht per month criteria to keep my Visa valid. My question, if I continue using Transferwize and the bank post as in-country transfer or ”SMART”, will it disqualify my 65k per month Visa criteria?
Tod *********
Now COULD you take print outs of your bank in your country showing the money leaving and the print out from the bank here showing the money getting here and make a case that you did indeed transfer the money? POSSIBLY but it's gonna come down to the discretion of the officer you're sitting in front of, and if you're denied whether you want to appeal it or not
Tod *********
Depending on the interpretation of the rule by the immigration officer it certainly COULD throw you right off the rails :O

The rules are clear, transfer in from abroad a minimum of 65K baht into a thai bank account in your name only each month for the preceding 12 months before you apply for your extension of stay. You prove this by the letter from the bank
Robert *******
officially seen yes. You need to show Immigration 12 months of foreign deposits into your bank account.
Steven *********
I didn't know that was an option. Sounds like they have taken notice of what is happening. Of the last 23 transfers I have done only 3 appeared as Thai bank transfers. I raised the problem with Transferwise some time ago.
Dan ******
These 3rd party transfer services are shaky to use & obviously not !00% reliable in meeting immigration expectations. However, unless you can walk into a bank in your home country to do a wire transfer, you may have no choice but to use these services. I was able to arrange wire transfer from my home country bank via the internet, but was no easy task,
Dan ******
There is much involved for those who use the monthly income method to provide immigration with proof of international money transfers from outside Thailand. This for people who are extending their visas. The whole thing is quite a mess really. ATM withdrawals don't work for such situations.
Anthony **********
So transferwise is just to save an international withdrawal ATM fee? Or is there more to it?
Nat ******
Show your paper trail. In Chiang Mai isn't a problem. True they probably give up after the 3rd set of bank statements for the same transaction but it is possible
Sevin *****
Transfered money Borderless USD to THB 2 months ago and this was not an option then, nor prior. Also, this same time was the first that didn't show as an International Transfer.
Andy *******
Following.
Andy *********
@Andy ******
saves you writing following on posts - now hv an option. By pressing 3 dots at top of message and selecting as per photo 👍
Andy *******
Andy *********
Ron *******
I have mailed them the question

Good evening. We are seeing a new funds transfer reason regarding sending money to Thailand. 'To help document funds transfer compliance with Thailand immigration for long term stay'. Using this option, will the funds transfer now 100% show as a foreign transfer rather than a local transfer as some incoming funds transfer do now?

Kind regards

Ron Angel
Joe ***********
ORIGINAL POSTER
The topic is TransferWise and funds transfer encoding - not the broad subject of funds transfer to Thailand.
John ********
@John *********
wrong, if the receiving bank isn't your home bank, they will transfer the funds on to your bank whereby it ceases to be a foreign transfer
John **********
@Roger *******
entirely down to how the receiving bank treats it
Roger ********
@John *********
then how come I have 10 out of 12 transfers marked as FTT (Foreign Transfer) on my bankstatement?
Joe ***********
ORIGINAL POSTER
John Stanners - You may be correct. But this new option may involved in tagging transfers as foreign or domestic when coming into Thailand. Time will tell. It is a new option - why put it there if it has no function? It may turn out to be wishful thinking - but then again - maybe not. It has been pointed out by other posters even Swift transfers may get coded wrong
John **********
@Joe **********
I understand exactly what you're saying but the crux of the matter is there is no international coding with TransferWise unless you use the swift option.
Joe ***********
ORIGINAL POSTER
As Tod has suggested - we are open to discuss this new wrinkle - but please take note of the narrow aspects of the subject. We should be testing to see if this new option has positive effect on transfer notation - International or domestic. Rehashing the entire scope of TransferWise adinfitium is not helpful - in fact it is counter productive.
Joe ***********
ORIGINAL POSTER
Folks, we just do not know where this new option will lead. As we monitor our transfers and take note of the Thai Bank Account deposit notations - we will soon see if it had any effect of tagging the transfer deposits as domestic or International. If this option has no positive effect then - back to square one.
Robert *******
yep, but if you follow the advice of transferwise it will be more expensive and that is not what is liked. There must be a way to sent money from a random bank in a random country to a bank account in Thailand and get a bonus as thank you for using our service. BTW As posted already this is the advice from Transferwise: best to choose the SWIFT method in the payment step of your transfer. SWIFT is a more expensive method, because it’s not a local transfer. But it does mean it’s easier to prove your money came from abroad.
John **********
This page on the TransferWise site is quite informative

*****************************************************************
*****
35/thb-transfers
Andy *********
that sums up the position quite nicely 👍
Karen ********
Yes I just did a transfer today and came across this I think it's away of Thailand knowing what money comes in.
John **********
@Karen *******
probably more to do with money laundering regs in the UK I'd have thought
Brad *****
send a email to tranferwise and they change it to international transaktion
Andy *********
@Brad ****
They hv 2 partners KK and BB but said they use the most efficient and cost effective way and my international tag will no longer work
Roger ********
Please tell us who. This is the response I had from TransferWise this morning
Brad *****
future transaction are marked international another member had the same problem that was what he did and they changed it.
Roger ********
Nope, they cannot
Peter *********
I just checked... It's there... I'll report back whether it comes in as an International transfer. My US Bank requires me to submit a wire in person, so that is not an option for me.
Peter *********
John **********
TransferWise whole business model is built around not doing actual international transfers. You pay the money IN your country and they use your money to pay out transfers TO your country. They use the reverse in the other country. Your money doesn't travel internationally. Unless you use the swift option of course but will be more expensive
Robert **********
@John *********
- with TMB if I am not mistaken.
John **********
Pretty sure that's up to the receiving bank than anything TransferWise does though. They pay the money out from their local account in Thailand. Money is locally delivered. This is from the test transfer screen in TransferWise app:

The recipient gets money in their currency directly from TransferWise's local bank account.
Roger ********
@Biff ******
quite, and they tell me that the majority will. It is only when the system is delayed for milli-seconds does the money find another way around - that is, through TransferWise's other partner bank.
Biff *******
As I wrote previously, all my TransferWise transfers, for the last year or so, have always shown in my Bangkok Bank account as international transfers. Recently that has changed.
Robert *******
I see this kind of topics coming by regular and every time the outcome is the same. Transferwise is cheap cheap because they use a system of national transfers. As you need for Immigration foreign deposits this cheap app is not the way to go or it is a risk to use. Choice is yours, go cheap take the risk of the wrong codes and do not get the Extension of Stay and activate your plan B OR use the more expensive swift code. For me there is not much more to add or keep on starting a discussion about it.
Dom **************
I agree this is an important topic and understand that many are trying to find the cheapest and most reliable way to transfer funds in Thailand. That being said, I understand that
@Robert ******
is the kind of person who will prefer using the safest way, which I would also do, by using SWIFT transfers that will show as international transfers (as long as you deal with legit banks that do a real SWIFT) rather than finding the cheapest and riskiest way to make that transfer, which is also reasonable since pouring down our money on those greedy banks wont help any of us in the future.
Joe ***********
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Robert ******
- Swift codes cannot always be done over the Internet.. Read the comments. And it has been posted here and on Thaivisa dot Com that even Swift transfers sometimes get coded domestic. Therefore in 12 months of 65K monthly funds transfers to Thailand as required by Thai Immigration - it only takes one domestic coding among 12 months of transfers to keep an Expat from getting a One Year Extension of Stay using monthly income. One Mistake out of 12 and in many if not most Immigration Offices - then the Expat is Denied.
Robert *******
i was expecting this answer. Use swift code to make it easier to prove your money came from abroad, not much to understand.
Joe ***********
ORIGINAL POSTER
Robert, by your comments it shows you just do not understand this subject.
Robert *******
option is clear, statement is to me very clear, so what is the problem :
Billy ************
@Robert ******
with respect TransferWise are very responsive to customer feedback; they are trying to identify options that meet with requirements of customers transferring funds to TH. We are all learning from feedback on these posts and responses
Robert *******
This issue is know at me and i never used this app, for more than 10 months just by following discussions on internet. Why keep people pushing for something to use that does not meet the requirements of the immigration? BTW I get my money in for the last 16 years within 24 hours after payment is made with a SWIFT code.
Biff *******
The issue is, that they can show as international transfers, but sometimes they don't. The SWIFT code can be used with Transferwise as well and they are quite responsive to customers so, it's useful for people to discuss it and share their experiences so that they can make better informed decisions.

I understand that you have little patience with things, especially things that don't affect you personally. However, others find it useful and it relates directly to their Thai visa experiences.
Roger ********
As this is likely to stay awhile this was the info I got from TransferWise this morning.
Dom **************
Good to know. Using the SWIFT method seems the best option but how more expensive would this be compared to a regular transfer over the course of 12 months?
Nat ******
I use orbit remit, at immigration i show my Australian bank account with the exact same funds transferred to orbit remit, then to my Thai account. Yes the Thai account says internal transfer, but if you show the paper trail at least in CM it works
Roger ********
I have checked with my bank (Bangkok) to find 2 entries in 12 months that read SMART. I have followed the FAQ and now know that those 2 went via Kasikorn Bank. I have printed off the TransferWise receipts and the next job will be to go to Kasikorn Bank to see what they will give me to show that they acted as a staging post to Bangkok bank.
Roger ********
Roger ********
Tod *********
Well, this certainly is an interesting development so lets run with it. I can't see any reason to close it at least until we know what's what.
@J**
, it's your topic, you keep people on point as much as you can okay?
Richard ********
Their website states, 'You'll need to give a reason for your transfer when sending to Thailand' so I guess its specific to Thailand.
Ron *******
I don't believe it does anything other than for compliance of UK banking law on international transfers. Transferwise simply don't move these funds internationaly but rely on partner banks in country.
Ron *******
@Joe **********
once I can log in, I will ask them the question and post the answer.
Joe ***********
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Ron ******
- This TW Reason option is brand new and may be significant and may not
Ron *******
@Joe **********
yes. All banking or financial institutions moving money wants to know the reasons. No different to me using my kasikorn app for sending international transfers. There is a list of reasons. I need to click one.
Joe ***********
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Ron ******
- Ron this option comes up to users of all countries - not just the countries of the UK only
Ron *******
Roger Lorton I'm not missing any point. The only point that matters is if immigration will accept pieces of paper or not which have been issued by a bank that you don't bank with.
Roger ********
@Ron ******
I think you are missing the point
Ron *******
@Roger *******
all very good as long as Immigration accept the non showing International transfer in your bank book.
Roger ********
@John *******
same here. Last 2 funnily enough. Transferwise tel me l can go to Kasikorn and get a letter
John ********
Most of mine go to Bangkok bank ( my bank) 2 recently have went via kasikorn. You can check this out by downloading the pdf receipt, it states it at the bottom
Ron *******
Transfers have always been sporadic using them to send to any account here other than a Bangkok bank account. I think it's funds going to a Bangkok bank is what has changed.
Biff *******
My transfers with them have always shown as international in my Thai bank. They have recently (the last two) shown as internal to Thailand. They have also taken slightly longer. They must have recently changed how they do them.
John ********
Just seen it, I will use of in future, I'm sure it's for the right reasons.
Anthony ************
I believe that one of these options (any one of them) must be selected to comply to UK law and has nothing to do the Thai athorities or transfer company's requirements.
Chris **********
Ive been using Transferwise for 3 years now and have always had to tick one of those options. I just click on monthly living expenses.
John ********
@Jonathan ************
I wouldn't think so, it's an aid to customers nothing else.
Joe ***********
ORIGINAL POSTER
@Anthony ***********
- This option comes up for all countries nothing to do with the UK only
Jonathan *************
@John *******
i wonder if the cost is different (charges/ rate?)
John ********
@Anthony ***********
I wouldn't think so, there has been specific issues with regards to transfers to Thailand surrounding money immigration must see coming in as a foreign transfer, although not everybody uses TransferWise for that purpose. I'm thinking it highlights the transfer reason to them to ensure it goes directly to the recipients bank and not through another receiving bank.
Anthony ************
@Jo**
, no idea Transfer Wise may be able to provide an answer. It may simply be that a reason must be supplied to the UK and they have just added it, as a logical reason, to the list.
John ********
Anthony J Webster why would they add it?, It's a new option
Richard ********
I have seen and used that option many times without issue
Jonathan *************
@Richard *******
thanks. The "issue" however here i believe is whether the method is going to be suitable for Thai immigration as evidence of a transfer from abroad for the monthly income method of an extension of stay based on retirement, marriage or a dependent Thai
Richard ********
@Jonathan ************
To SCB bank from the UK. I received the money in Thailand without issue.
Richard ********
@Biff ******
I have not checked my statement so cant comment, but as far as I know there are no changes. The app just asks for a reason as to why you are transferring the money. I guess its to do with laundering?
Jonathan *************
what do you mean "without issue" please? It shows as an international transfer? To which bank?
Biff *******
And did the resulting transfer show up as international? Has that changed recently?
Roger ********
SMART indicates an internal transfer.
Roger ********
@John *******
no, l was talking about monthly income
John ********
@Roger *******
I think you were talking about the lump sum method, we're talking about the monthly income method, different rules apply
Roger ********
if you look down the page you will see the email l got from Transferwise this morning. No mention of an app
Roger ********
@Chris *****
internal, not foreign
Chris ******
Few....... That is worth a beer from my perspective........... :)
Roger ********
l know because l was at the bank today.
Tom *****
This sounds promising. Following
Joe ***********
ORIGINAL POSTER
Let's Hope
Michael *********
If I'd have to guess, I'd say that transferwise have found a solution the fund not originating from overseas to cater for long term stay in Thailand with a recent update Will be interesting to see what happens
Michael *********
Even if you had to pay a swift fee.. the rate would still be better than your bank gives you if you were "recycling" money as income it would still be worth while
Biff *******
Maybe, but my bank charges less than that for SWIFT transfers, so if they did that, they'd lose customers. Well, they'd lose at least one customer :)
Jonathan *************
@Biff ******
could add 25 quid SWIFT transfer fee?
Biff *******
I know they're fairly good at responding to customers and I imagine they've had quite a lot of questions about this from people in Thailand. But usually, after you select the reason for the transfer, there's another section where you select the method. It's my understanding that selecting SWIFT as the method would make sure it shows as international when it arrives in your Thai bank. But maybe, just maybe, selecting this new reason for the transfer will work as well.
Michael *********
@Biff ******
yeah it would really suck if it was just a means of collating data lol
Biff *******
I would imagine that they have. There was another post (here maybe?) that had copies of correspondence from TW saying that the SWIFT option should be chosen if it's important that the transfer shows as international. It might slow down the transfer and maybe cost a bit more but would meet the requirements of immigration once completed.

I'm not sure if selecting this reason for the transfer would work or not. I'll use it next time and see what effect, if any, it has.
Joe ***********
ORIGINAL POSTER
Sorry about my innacurate paraphrasing
Joe ***********
ORIGINAL POSTER
I have never used that option - just saw it a few days ago
Thomas ********************
I imagine they've been busy with requests from expats recently :) But, cf above, looks like it's no joy.
Biff *******
I don't think it was there before. I've only seen it since you posted about it.
Manfred ********
just initiated a test transfer to my Thai account.

The option is available...

will report on the result of the transfer
Manfred ********
this is a cutout of an online statement request...

whatever MCL means as transfer code
Manfred ********
@Giorgio ******
of course but I would like to see the printout in the passbook
Giorgio *******
@Manfred *******
No online banking?
Manfred ********
will update the passbook to see the exact info of this transfer
Manfred ********
at least it's fast. The money is here:

02/08/19 17:24 A/C XXX received {exactly the amount transferwise specified} Baht from A/C X
*****
*****
/19 17:24 A/C XXX received {exactly the amount transferwise specified} Baht from A/C X888899X Outstanding Balance xxx Baht.

20 minutes for the whole procedure...

if you need money very quickly 555
Manfred ********
sorry for the bad quality but the important information should be readable...
Manfred ********
Giorgio *******
weekend now so wait for monday I guess
Joe ***********
ORIGINAL POSTER
I think that since my TW THB Recipient Bank is in Thailand - therefore this,new option pops up.
Joe ***********
ORIGINAL POSTER
I am aware of that John. But the point is this new Reason for Transfer option. It could have a positive effect on how transfers are labeled - we will find out
John ********
@Joe **********
they use 2, sometimes not directly to the recipients account
Biff *******
I just had a look on my TransferWise app and it says "Funds for long term stay in Thailand" I have no idea if, or how, it affects the method of transfer. I have, however, noticed that recently my transfers haveNOT been shown as international whereas they previously all have.
Roger ********
@Biff ******
lposted about this some hours ago.
Roger ********
For me (hate typing on phone)
Biff *******
Same for me.
Roger ********
@Biff ******
last 2 out of 12 have been internal (SMART)
Steve *******
No I not seen that ...maybe that would indicate it would be done as a international transfer but take longer possibly...interesting
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